Womad 2018

[Lat-Literal]

Unlikely to be a lengthy thread but a couple of comments. It feels like the coverage on BBC R3 across the weekend is slightly shorter but I could be wrong. The first programme got off to a shaky start with the continuity announcer stumbling over his words on several occasions during the lead in, either uncomfortable or unknowledgeable, and Lopa describing Polish band Hanba! as Haniba on two occasions before getting it right. The BBC website has comments from the main organiser to the effect that the Brexit effect has played havoc with artists obtaining visas. But I know from announcements of last minute cancellations when at the festival that there have always been these problems although they could now be worse.

The tone of his interview - words like "sad" - and the photos that have been published do not suggest massive crowds. Again, I could be wrong. But live music is becoming pricier. The weather forecast wasn't good. The RMT strikes are untimely and arguably there wasn't a truly gobsmacking headliner this year. Many of the candidates for such a billing are themselves becoming older. Nothing against the likes of Leftfield - there was always the whirl-y-gig for modern dance - but there might well be more of these sorts of acts now. It doesn't seem to me that they are necessarily the way to get more people in. That has always been about a combination of the N'Dours, Keitas etc and the hitherto unknown but imaginatively unusual.

[Globaltruth]

Unlikely to be a lengthy thread but a couple of comments. It feels like the coverage on BBC R3 across the weekend is slightly shorter but I could be wrong. The first programme got off to a shaky start with the continuity announcer stumbling over his words on several occasions during the lead in, either uncomfortable or unknowledgeable, and Lopa describing Polish band Hanba! as Haniba on two occasions before getting it right. The BBC website has comments from the main organiser to the effect that the Brexit effect has played havoc with artists obtaining visas. But I know from announcements of last minute cancellations when at the festival that there have always been these problems although they could now be worse.

The tone of his interview - words like "sad" - and the photos that have been published do not suggest massive crowds. Again, I could be wrong. But live music is becoming pricier. The weather forecast wasn't good. The RMT strikes are untimely and arguably there wasn't a truly gobsmacking headliner this year. Many of the candidates for such a billing are themselves becoming older. Nothing against the likes of Leftfield - there was always the whirl-y-gig for modern dance - but there might well be more of these sorts of acts now. It doesn't seem to me that they are necessarily the way to get more people in. That has always been about a combination of the N'Dours, Keitas etc and the hitherto unknown but imaginatively unusual.

Seems a fair critique to me Lat. I do think some of the other festivals have nicked their lunch as it were, by broadening their range of acts - including the occasional 'exotic', although I should have to do some analysis before I could claim that as anything other than a perception.
I've never been convinced that the live coverage works on r3 anyway, so maybe they should stop (esp. as they give extensive coverage to your festival, Lat-itude). I'm sure we could suggest many other ways to spend that budget.

[MrGongGong]

The BBC website has comments from the main organiser to the effect that the Brexit effect has played havoc with artists obtaining visas. But I know from announcements of last minute cancellations when at the festival that there have always been these problems although they could now be worse.
.

Sadly they are much much worse
and not likely to get any better i'm afraid

but we have been here before many times and some folks can only see Brigadoon

[johncorrigan]

Cerys is at Womad this morning though sounds like the heatwave's over; saying that I didn't see much sign of it out west. Anyway she played a bit of Camille this morning - sounding mighty fine in that Prince type of way except with raspberries.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OPGNWFQy_gg

[Lat-Literal]

Cerys is at Womad this morning though sounds like the heatwave's over; saying that I didn't see much sign of it out west. Anyway she played a bit of Camille this morning - sounding mighty fine in that Prince type of way except with raspberries.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OPGNWFQy_gg

Oh that's interesting - perhaps that is the extra bit of the BBC's output then. I think you have been on holiday JC. I hope you enjoyed it. I wondered if you had started at Carnoustie. In the first R3 programme, they had a fairly short session by Mari Kalkun of Estonia. I thought it was rather good, reminiscent as it is of the Norwegian Saomi music of Adjegas etc. etc.

Mari Kalkun - Keelega-Meelega - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zfG7E5q2Mx4

[Lat-Literal]

Seems a fair critique to me Lat. I do think some of the other festivals have nicked their lunch as it were, by broadening their range of acts - including the occasional 'exotic', although I should have to do some analysis before I could claim that as anything other than a perception.
I've never been convinced that the live coverage works on r3 anyway, so maybe they should stop (esp. as they give extensive coverage to your festival, Lat-itude). I'm sure we could suggest many other ways to spend that budget.

Thank you GT. I had the site of Latitude pointed out to me last August but have never bought a ticket. It would appeal to me what with its poetry readings etc too but I do get the impression that it is self-consciously middle class, much as Southwold and Aldborough are whereas Lowestoft and Great Yarmouth are pure bucket and spade. That is probably why I prefer to be on the footpaths between the two. On the coverage of Womad, I don't mind the radio output but I have always felt that the BBC doesn't know quite how to approach it.

In the days of Andrew McGregor, it was to some extent academic. The emphasis could often be on the unusual musical instruments and ideas that it was all not so far removed from classical music. With Kathryn Tickell, the inference is that folk music is the more natural interface and Cerys brings in an element of Q magazine perhaps. By background, indie, blues, reggae...….you name it......and in terms of fandom one of the few rangy female musical experts/train spotters. If she were in sports broadcasting, she would probably be an all-rounder.

I have been thinking about this area more recently. Whether it is a sports event or a music event, people are there with their families or their mates. What are effectively journos arrive and other than the true enthusiasts they tend to know more. They are often the people who introduced the events to most of us in the first place. But they are also in work when they are there and trying to square the circle between that and just fun. It is a clique of a kind and that comes across in awkward down with the kids presentation at Glastonbury or slightly aloof and off centre observations from a radio tent on other festivals' peripheries. Also, as Motson said recently, he saw more of the 2018 World Cup than any other because he wasn't working and was able to see everything on television. I possibly had it better in many ways. I was in theory with friends and on very rare occasions some friends had some family in tow. But I dipped in and out of those groups, often going off on my own to see what I wanted to see; be a "journalist" who was under no work pressure as it was a concept in my head.

It is true, I think, that Womad style acts are crossing over into other festivals. We've seen this with the likes of Tinariwen and more recently Songhoy Blues. At some festivals - Celtic Connections and Glastonbury - that goes beyond the token gesture and at others - the increasing number of so-called boutique events - it will happen because many will take anything they can get to produce a decent number of acts. Anyhow, mostly I think I would like the R3 coverage of Womad to continue. Womad has a unique place in world music's history and it is in my opinion a kingpin even if from time to time it needs rejuvenating. I would prefer a television programme on BBC4 to back it up but it is unlikely that this will happen very soon.

[johncorrigan]

Been enjoying this evening's trip to WOMAD, I have to say. Really enjoyed the master musician from Morocco - was travelling so didn't catch the name, and a terrific mixtape from Ian Brennan, he who brought us the Malawi Mouse Boys and the Albinism Collective among others. Plenty to enjoy including on this day of Welsh Tour celebration a fine Welsh band too, Calan.

[Lat-Literal]

Cerys is at Womad this morning though sounds like the heatwave's over; saying that I didn't see much sign of it out west. Anyway she played a bit of Camille this morning - sounding mighty fine in that Prince type of way except with raspberries.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OPGNWFQy_gg

I have listened to this edition in full and liked it a lot - Ezra Collective although their music was much better than the records they chose; the Bollywood Brass Band interview with the memorable recorded track from Asha Bhosle; the interview with the events co-ordinator; less so the trip around the food stalls as we get quite a lot of that sort of things elsewhere.

[oddoneout]

Re visa problems this may be of interest

https://www.theguardian.com/global/2018/aug/02/womad-visa-fiasco-brexit-britain-live-music-festival

I find the fact that those who have come over in the past have been facing difficulties worrying.

[Lat-Literal]

Re visa problems this may be of interest

https://www.theguardian.com/global/2018/aug/02/womad-visa-fiasco-brexit-britain-live-music-festival

I find the fact that those who have come over in the past have been facing difficulties worrying.

I don't understand a lot of this.

The events co-ordinator said that visas had become more difficult in the past two years while admitting there were huge problems in the 1980s. I know as I said before that they were also a problem for Womad in the late 1990s/early 2000s because we the audience were given announcements. Gabriel and many others mention Brexit. The timing appears to coincide but that is about all. Brexit hasn't happened yet. Most of the artists experiencing problems are not from EU countries. If Britain is really the most difficult country to get into for touring musicians, as stated, then not only the rest of the EU but other countries around the world which are not in the EU, including Australia, New Zealand and Chile where Womad is also held, are less difficult. It is neither an EU or a non EU thing. And as the World Cup showed, England supporters - people exiting this country briefly for non work reasons - had a devil a job getting the authorisation here to go into Russia. In contrast, so many Peruvians and other South Americans were there that their countries were emptied out. One journalist on Talksport explained that it was because of the sheer ease in all of them being waved through.

The suggestion by the House of Lords European Committee, mentioned in the article in the link, that musicians of this kind be given a flexible visa to go from EU country to EU country while being on tour largely ignores the facts as I have outlined. It also belongs to the political wing of clawing back the pre referendum regime before any significant change occurs. Rather, I would have thought where a musician can be confirmed as having a working role for one night in Malmesbury or even four or five nights if they are also performing in other British places, they should not officially be placed in the same category as people who are working here in advanced electronics or fruit picking for a month or three months. I know of a British bloke who is a computer whizz. He's in Dublin on one day advising companies and on the next day he is in Oslo. I'm pretty sure he doesn't need visas at every turn. Nor am I wholly convinced by what is being said when you never get this issue arising with big names. Youssou N'Dour, Seu Jorge, Toumani Diabate, Angelique Kidjo and Amadou and Mariam and elsewhere A-ha, Shakira and Kylie Minogue. These don't ever appear to have visa problems.

[MrGongGong]

I don't understand a lot of this.



......


I know of a British bloke who is a computer whizz. He's in Dublin on one day advising companies and on the next day he is Oslo. I'm pretty sure he doesn't need visas at every turn. Nor am I wholly convinced by what is being said when you never get this issue arising with truly big names. Youssou N'Dour, Seu Jorge, Toumani Diabate, Angelique Kidjo and Amadou and Mariam and elsewhere A-ha, Shakira and Kylie Minogue. These don't ever appear to have visa problems.

I would agree with your first statement
Many musicians (famous and not so) have massive visa problems and issues, all the time... most of us who work in music will be able to tell you about people being refused permission to enter/exit various countries and so on.

You don't need a visa to travel in the EU or to Scandinavia from Ireland
BUT as we are about to (apparently?) leave all of these arrangements no-one knows what will happen?
What I do know, from my recent work in Portugal, is that no-one knows.
BUT if we DO end up on the same basis as musicians from outside the EU it will be a huge deal and mean many of the specialist musicians who live in the UK and have European careers will leave... Though according to some, i'm just making this up rather than listening to those for whom this has a direct and rapidly approaching effect.

[Lat-Literal]

I would agree with your first statement
Many musicians (famous and not so) have massive visa problems and issues, all the time... most of us who work in music will be able to tell you about people being refused permission to enter/exit various countries and so on.

You don't need a visa to travel in the EU or to Scandinavia from Ireland
BUT as we are about to (apparently?) leave all of these arrangements no-one knows what will happen?
What I do know, from my recent work in Portugal, is that no-one knows.
BUT if we DO end up on the same basis as musicians from outside the EU it will be a huge deal and mean many of the specialist musicians who live in the UK and have European careers will leave... Though according to some, i'm just making this up rather than listening to those for whom this has a direct and rapidly approaching effect.

Well, it needs to be sorted.

I have now been given the same statement by five people in the last year : "they are building houses in my area on every last scrap of green space - it has all gone". The areas are Polegate (East Sussex), Sittingbourne (Kent), Romford (Essex), Ealing (West London) and Haverhill (Suffolk). The first, I know, is a Green supporter, not sure on Brexit, the next three are lifelong left wing Labour voters, two pro Brexit and one anti, and the last was a minicab driver who attends Latitude so I don't know but none of them is exactly Jacob Rees-Mogg. Nor would any of them want international musicians to be affected in this way. In fact, in my time I've been with two of the Labour ones to Glastonbury and one to Womad. It's all very well for people in areas of space or those who love urban life to have a different opinion but here in the South East this is the gist of it. We don't want to live in a Metropolitan hell.

[johncorrigan]

One of the issues that was mentioned, I think on Cerys' show last Sunday, was the high cost of applying for visas whether they were successful or not in getting the visas. I don't have any knowledge of these issues, but the assumption was that the UK is getting a reputation among musicians as being a place becoming more difficult and more expensive to get to so they are not bothering to apply, and going elsewhere instead. As I said, I don't have first hand knowledge of this, but musicians are facing what lots of others seem to be facing.

[MrGongGong]

Well, it needs to be sorted.

I have now been given the same statement by five people in the last year : "they are building houses in my area on every last scrap of green space - it has all gone". The areas are Polegate (East Sussex), Sittingbourne (Kent), Romford (Essex), Ealing (West London) and Haverhill (Suffolk). The first, I know, is a Green supporter, not sure on Brexit, the next three are lifelong left wing Labour voters, two pro Brexit and one anti, and the last was a minicab driver who attends Latitude so I don't know but none of them is exactly Jacob Rees-Mogg. Nor would any of them want international musicians to be affected in this way. In fact, in my time I've been with two of the Labour ones to Glastonbury and one to Womad. It's all very well for people in areas of space or those who love urban life to have a different opinion but here in the South East this is the gist of it. We don't want to live in a Metropolitan hell.

Which has F-all to do with musicians being able to travel in the EU and work.
What on earth are you on about ? on second thoughts i'm not really asking.

Try this

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-41901294

We don't want to live in a Metropolitan hell.

Maybe you need to look away from Ealing ?

The UK is being SWAMPED by Kora players ?

[Beef Oven!]

I would agree with your first statement
Many musicians (famous and not so) have massive visa problems and issues, all the time... most of us who work in music will be able to tell you about people being refused permission to enter/exit various countries and so on.

You don't need a visa to travel in the EU or to Scandinavia from Ireland
BUT as we are about to (apparently?) leave all of these arrangements no-one knows what will happen?
What I do know, from my recent work in Portugal, is that no-one knows.
BUT if we DO end up on the same basis as musicians from outside the EU it will be a huge deal and mean many of the specialist musicians who live in the UK and have European careers will leave... Though according to some, i'm just making this up rather than listening to those for whom this has a direct and rapidly approaching effect.