Joe Boyd's A-Z

[Lat-Literal]

Don't want to put the mockers on this, Lat, but might be the best yet in this wonderful series by JB. There's so much to say, but I'll start with the link:

'Out on the Rolling Sea' by John Roberts sets us out on

http://www.acast.com/boydaz/lettero

So of course we get taken on a trip to that corner of Andros Island in the Caribbean, and Sam Charters' trip there on the back of hearing some of the Lomax recordings; and hear about Frederick McQueen and Charters' discovery of Ry Cooder's great inspiration, Joseph Spence. I'll leave it there before I go on too much. Joe tells it better.

Hi JC, that was an excellent episode. Many of the vocals were extraordinary. My favourite gospel songs tend to have elements of idiosyncrasy - Jesus as a friend - a powerful understatement; a reference to "a motor gone"; birds; technological connections - ships and aeroplanes and trains and radiation. An idiosyncratic singing style - to our ears - is also helpful and fascinating. In this episode, there were several wonderful examples. When it comes to mere words, I wouldn't self-define re religion. I am officially C of E. That's cool. Anyhow, perhaps I'm too vague; more than a bit "spiritual". But in musical terms I'm a true believer. I'm not sure that I would wholly separate music and religion in my mind. Soul music. That term itself covers considerable ground. I just wonder sometimes if that is the crucial point that the political miss in any sort of parliament, whether secular or devout.

JB made some amazing musical connections, not least to the Beach Boys' "Sloop John B". I will be talking about those soon in one of the above threads. Mainly Brian. I like the McGarrigles to whom Joe referred, have always lacked knowledge on the Incredible String Band but I think of you as I know you are a fan, and the prospect of a Tannenbaum CD in, what, 2016 is mind-boggling. Loudon III will have his say no doubt. So: the Soul Stirrers - I was introduced to them by this forum - and led initially by Van - Mahalia Jackson:

Soul Stirrers - Jesus Hits Like The Atom Bomb - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F4HIJits-Zc
Mahalia Jackson - His Eye Is On The Sparrow - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xli52WQdrWE

[johncorrigan]

It's interesting that on two of Joe's most renowned productions, 'Kate and Anna McGarrigle' and 'Hangman's Beautiful Daughter' two of the classic tracks should be reworkings of the Bahamanians. The Incredible String Band's reworking of 'Sleep on Beloved' forms the first part of 'A Very Cellular Song - here's 'I Bid you Goodnight'.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cJfV-a24TOY

Here's a wee bit about the song from this site re the Waterson/ Carthy version - https://mainlynorfolk.info/watersons...onbeloved.html

Sleep On Beloved / I Bid You Goodnight

[ Roud 15632 ; Ballad Index DTbidgni ; trad.]

Norma Waterson and Martin and Eliza Carthy sang the funeral song Sleep On Beloved in 1994 on Waterson:Carthy's eponymous debut album Waterson:Carthy. This track was reissued in 2003 on The Definitive Collection. They also sang it at their homecoming concert at Hull Truck Theatre on August 15, 2010 to celebrate Norma's 71st birthday. This was released in 2011 on their DVD Live at Hull Truck. Martin Carthy commented in their first recording's sleeve notes:


In the 1960s, the Incredible String Band renamed a song called I Bid You Goodnight which they learned from Jody Stecher's recordings of the great Bahamian guitarist Joseph Spence and his family, the Pinder family, and the song became, for some folkies, one of those great standards. A year or two ago John Howson visited Staithes to record the Fisherman's Choir, and was accompanied by Maggie Hunt who, at the same time, was interviewing the individuals involved. During conversations, a Mr Willie Wright sang a snatch of the Sankey hymn Sleep On Beloved which he described as a lowering down song at funerals, and which was clearly the same song as I Bid You Goodnight but in an earlier form, and when Norma heard it, she went to see Willie, who kindly proved her with the other verses. When we sang the song to Jody Stecher, he was enormously pleased, not least because its function as a funeral song in the Bahamian fishing community was identical to that in its North Yorkshire counterpart.

Words: Sarah Doudney, Psalms of Life (published by Houlston), 1871.
Music: Ira David Sankey.

Doudney wrote the lyrics on the occasion of a friend's death. Sankey saw them while in Bristol, England, and wrote music for them shortly thereafter. The song was sung at the funeral of preacher Charles Haddon Spurgeon.

The Incredible String Band's version mentioned in Martin Carthy's notes is part of their A Very Cellular Song on the 1968 album The Hangman's Beautiful Daughter. Joseph Spence sang I Bid You Goodnight with the Pinder Family in 1965 on the anthology The Real Bahamas in Music and Songs (Nonesuch H-2013 / H-72013), and he sang it in 1972 on his album Good Morning Mr Walker.


I was also interested in Joe's mention of the visit of Sam Charters and his wife to Andros Island in the Bahamas. Here's Joe talking about Charters in a piece he wrote shortly after Charters' death earlier this year. It's about halfway down the page and includes his first encounter, on a building site, of Joseph Spence.

http://www.joeboyd.co.uk/new-events-geoff-muldaur-and-sam-charters/

[Globaltruth]

It's interesting that on two of Joe's most renowned productions, 'Kate and Anna McGarrigle' and 'Hangman's Beautiful Daughter' two of the classic tracks should be reworkings of the Bahamanians. The Incredible String Band's reworking of 'Sleep on Beloved' forms the first part of 'A Very Cellular Song - here's 'I Bid you Goodnight'.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cJfV-a24TOY

Here's a wee bit about the song from this site re the Waterson/ Carthy version - https://mainlynorfolk.info/watersons...onbeloved.html

Sleep On Beloved / I Bid You Goodnight

[ Roud 15632 ; Ballad Index DTbidgni ; trad.]

Norma Waterson and Martin and Eliza Carthy sang the funeral song Sleep On Beloved in 1994 on Waterson:Carthy's eponymous debut album Waterson:Carthy. This track was reissued in 2003 on The Definitive Collection. They also sang it at their homecoming concert at Hull Truck Theatre on August 15, 2010 to celebrate Norma's 71st birthday. This was released in 2011 on their DVD Live at Hull Truck. Martin Carthy commented in their first recording's sleeve notes:


In the 1960s, the Incredible String Band renamed a song called I Bid You Goodnight which they learned from Jody Stecher's recordings of the great Bahamian guitarist Joseph Spence and his family, the Pinder family, and the song became, for some folkies, one of those great standards. A year or two ago John Howson visited Staithes to record the Fisherman's Choir, and was accompanied by Maggie Hunt who, at the same time, was interviewing the individuals involved. During conversations, a Mr Willie Wright sang a snatch of the Sankey hymn Sleep On Beloved which he described as a lowering down song at funerals, and which was clearly the same song as I Bid You Goodnight but in an earlier form, and when Norma heard it, she went to see Willie, who kindly proved her with the other verses. When we sang the song to Jody Stecher, he was enormously pleased, not least because its function as a funeral song in the Bahamian fishing community was identical to that in its North Yorkshire counterpart.

Words: Sarah Doudney, Psalms of Life (published by Houlston), 1871.
Music: Ira David Sankey.

Doudney wrote the lyrics on the occasion of a friend's death. Sankey saw them while in Bristol, England, and wrote music for them shortly thereafter. The song was sung at the funeral of preacher Charles Haddon Spurgeon.

The Incredible String Band's version mentioned in Martin Carthy's notes is part of their A Very Cellular Song on the 1968 album The Hangman's Beautiful Daughter. Joseph Spence sang I Bid You Goodnight with the Pinder Family in 1965 on the anthology The Real Bahamas in Music and Songs (Nonesuch H-2013 / H-72013), and he sang it in 1972 on his album Good Morning Mr Walker.


I was also interested in Joe's mention of the visit of Sam Charters and his wife to Andros Island in the Bahamas. Here's Joe talking about Charters in a piece he wrote shortly after Charters' death earlier this year. It's about halfway down the page and includes his first encounter, on a building site, of Joseph Spence.
http://www.joeboyd.co.uk/new-events-...-sam-charters/

Nice post JC - can't beat a bit of ethnomusicology.... JB would be proud, so would the Watersons. We're off to Normafest in Jan...(http://www.scarboroughspa.co.uk/even...t-January-2016) bound to be sunny and warm; inside at least.

[johncorrigan]

Nice post JC - can't beat a bit of ethnomusicology.... JB would be proud, so would the Watersons. We're off to Normafest in Jan...(http://www.scarboroughspa.co.uk/even...t-January-2016) bound to be sunny and warm; inside at least.

Thank Global - Scarborough in January sounds nippy - but fun...if you avoid Eddi Reader (in my opinion).
Every time the Bahamas comes up in conversation I remember a Bahamas' LP a pal had back in the the early 80s. On it was a track called 'Little Black Moustache' which haunted me and has ever since. I'd forgotten the name of the singer but just had a trawl around and found it on a website called Furious Music. The track's by Lyndall Albury and you can have a listen after the information - still hauntingly wonderful.

http://www.furiousmusic.co.uk/?tag=bahamas

[Globaltruth]

Thank Global - Scarborough in January sounds nippy - but fun...if you avoid Eddi Reader (in my opinion).
Every time the Bahamas comes up in conversation I remember a Bahamas' LP a pal had back in the the early 80s. On it was a track called 'Little Black Moustache' which haunted me and has ever since. I'd forgotten the name of the singer but just had a trawl around and found it on a website called Furious Music. The track's by Lyndall Albury and you can have a listen after the information - still hauntingly wonderful.
http://www.furiousmusic.co.uk/?tag=bahamas

thanks for both of those JC - I agree re Eddi Reader, we walked out of her set when we saw her in Stornoway a few years back. Boo Hewardine is a friend of a friend...
I can't understand why Waterson's aren't headlining that night.

Anyway,back to the Bahamas (where we'd all rather be I'm guessing)....here's a good article from Folkways about Joseph Spence, not sure whether you've seen it already

http://www.folkways.si.edu/joseph-spence-bahamian-master-guitarist/world/music/article/smithsonian

in which it says

Spence remains a cult favorite, influencing such noted performers as Ry Cooder, Taj Mahal, the Incredible String, and Brian Wilson

The article mentions Frederick McQueen

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KXQUtNCih6A

I'm not too sure what his cuckoo eye is, perhaps best not to know?
Also on Spotify

https://open.spotify.com/album/1pOE6RpmOmJWhM1MThhQNi

With Joseph Spence on a Folkways recording:

https://open.spotify.com/album/63SeTJ5NzfNccMY9BiEAQL

[johncorrigan]

Anyway,back to the Bahamas (where we'd all rather be I'm guessing)....here's a good article from Folkways about Joseph Spence, not sure whether you've seen it already

http://www.folkways.si.edu/joseph-spence-bahamian-master-guitarist/world/music/article/smithsonian

I thought a very telling comment from the article was Charters' description of Spence's playing, Global.
'He growled occasional words and phrases of the piece he was playing, as much to help him keep track of where he was as it was to actually 'sing' something...."
You can hear it here on 'Coming in on a wing and a prayer'.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dYmnJ5WmR3U

Wonderful guitar playing.
As you say Ry Cooder was very influenced by Joseph Spence and, according to Joe Boyd, went out to the Bahamas to spend time with him. Here's Cooder's take on the same song from 'Boomer's Story'.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P35JHf6gyMs

[johncorrigan]

in which it says
Spence remains a cult favorite, influencing such noted performers as Ry Cooder, Taj Mahal, the Incredible String, and Brian Wilson

...and of course Eliza, G.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XRmyyfvh9fM

Here's Joseph...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yjd6ou1PvAE

Don't think she got the vocals from him, mind you!

[Globaltruth]

...and of course Eliza, G.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XRmyyfvh9fM

....
Don't think she got the vocals from him, mind you!

she did that as part of the set when we saw her recently.In a rip-snorting version, she referenced The Mighty Sparrow - the lyrics tell a joyful tale of blatant greed
Here he is:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SbYOHqXinbc

[johncorrigan]

she did that as part of the set when we saw her recently.In a rip-snorting version, she referenced The Mighty Sparrow - the lyrics tell a joyful tale of blatant greed
Here he is:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SbYOHqXinbc

Yep! sounds like the Sparrow was behind that right enough, Global.

[johncorrigan]

After the delights of 'O', it's 'P' and Joe suggests that the true heir to Woody Guthrie was not Dylan, as Pete Seeger had thought, but Phil Ochs. So Joe starts with Ochs' 'The Power and the Glory'. I sometimes think Ochs gets overlooked because he has a very pleasant voice maybe without the grit of others. Wrote some fine songs, mind you.

http://www.acast.com/boydaz/letterp

[Lat-Literal]

After the delights of 'O', it's 'P' and Joe suggests that the true heir to Woody Guthrie was not Dylan, as Pete Seeger had thought, but Phil Ochs. So Joe starts with Ochs' 'The Power and the Glory'. I sometimes think Ochs gets overlooked because he has a very pleasant voice maybe without the grit of others. Wrote some fine songs, mind you.
http://www.acast.com/boydaz/letterp

Thanks, JC. Another interesting episode. I'm a fan of Phil Ochs who was introduced to me nearly 30 years ago by a woman friend at work. I think there are very close parallels with Victor Jara who was mentioned by Joe Boyd. The two albums I have on CD are ""Rehearsals for Retirement" and "Gunfight at Carnegie Hall" but I also have other songs by him on tape including "Love Me I'm A Liberal". They may well be from "An Introduction To......" He had a good sense of humour along with seriousness. Given recent discussions about Paul Robeson who popularised "Joe Hill" long before Joan Baez did the same at Woodstock, I am posting Phil Ochs's version. And the wonderful title track of "Rehearsals For Retirement"

Phil Ochs:

The Ballad of Joe Hill - Live - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yUR2PDTptO0
Rehearsals For Retirement - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rGRLazETWa8

[johncorrigan]

Thanks, JC. Another interesting episode. I'm a fan of Phil Ochs who was introduced to me nearly 30 years ago by a woman friend at work. I think there are very close parallels with Victor Jara who was mentioned by Joe Boyd. The two albums I have on CD are ""Rehearsals for Retirement" and "Gunfight at Carnegie Hall" but I also have other songs by him on tape including "Love Me I'm A Liberal". They may well be from "An Introduction To......" He had a good sense of humour along with seriousness. Given recent discussions about Paul Robeson who popularised "Joe Hill" long before Joan Baez did the same at Woodstock, I am posting Phil Ochs's version. And the wonderful title track of "Rehearsals For Retirement"

Phil Ochs:

The Ballad of Joe Hill - Live - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yUR2PDTptO0
Rehearsals For Retirement - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rGRLazETWa8

Lat, his memory is kept alive up here through his tribute act, Phil Ochs-aye-the-noo.

[Lat-Literal]

Lat, his memory is kept alive up here through his tribute act, Phil Ochs-aye-the-noo.

Is he related to the Marras?

[johncorrigan]

Is he related to the Marras?

Na, Lat, ra day efter!

[Lat-Literal]

Na, Lat, ra day efter!

Yes, that is what I thought.