Prom 49: Rattle conducts Mahler’s ‘Resurrection’ Symphony (24.08.22)

[kernelbogey]

...it left me curiously unmoved....

I was relutctant to say anything like that in my earlier post #34, because of the relatively poor quality of my audio, and of my attention - but felt that too.

I heard, and was gripped by, Santtu-Matias Rouvali conducting the Philharmonia at RFH recently (can't find the exact date) in Mahler 2, and felt all the familiar emotions - and no criticism of the words or the Christianity.

But my most impressing performance, and touchstone for all others, was Lorin Maazel conducting the Philharmonia at the Festival Hall on 2 June 1976 (I found the programme!): that ppp chorus entry was as -issimo as any I've heard - unforgettable.

In Birmingham the CBSO chorus (unaided and without copies!) made THE most magical entry, quadruple piano**.

** Ooh, I didn't know that's what it's called...!

[Roger Judd]

Organ nerd warning! Earlier mention was made of seeing so many stops drawn at the console. At the RAH to make maximum 'noise' you would need no more a dozen stops drawn! For me, the organ didn't make the overwhelming contribution it should, because the heaviest and deepest pedal stops didn't seem to be engaged ... the big 16' and 32' Bombardes (or whatever they are called there). In the CBSO /Stenz performance in Symphony Hall they were all gloriously present, underpinning the whole texture wonderfully, and helping to bring that performance to a thrilling conclusion. In Birmingham the CBSO chorus (unaided and without copies!) made THE most magical entry, quadruple piano.
RJ

[EnemyoftheStoat]

Sorry to grumble, but choruses who sing Mahler 2 every other week - OK, every six months - shouldn't need copies. So much is made of this "feat"...

[Roger Judd]

I don't think any chorus has sung Mahler 2 for at least two years and, because of Covid, chorus members have dropped out / felt reluctant to be in a big group, so the choral scene is not yet as it once was.
RJ

[Keraulophone]

In the CBSO /Stenz performance in Symphony Hall they were all gloriously present, underpinning the whole texture wonderfully, and helping to bring that performance to a thrilling conclusion. In Birmingham the CBSO chorus (unaided and without copies!) made THE most magical entry, quadruple piano.
RJ

My friend who accompanied me to this LSO/Rattle concert had also been at the Birmingham/Stentz performance, which he said he'd enjoyed rather more. From his comments, I concluded that many of the positive attributes of the CBSO's performance that he mentioned were due to the extraordinarily fine acoustics of Symphony Hall compared with those of the vast RAH. If the Prom performance had taken place in Symphony Hall, I think we'd all have been 'blown away' (in modern parlance).
.

[Ein Heldenleben]

Sorry to grumble, but choruses who sing Mahler 2 every other week - OK, every six months - shouldn't need copies. So much is made of this "feat"...

Agreed but I think the optional low Bflat in the basses is worth making a fuss about though . Any one done it? I can get to E Nat but Bflat ? In the next life perhaps .

[kernelbogey]

In the next life perhaps .

Natch!

[cloughie]

Sorry to grumble, but choruses who sing Mahler 2 every other week - OK, every six months - shouldn't need copies. So much is made of this "feat"...

As a MVC singer where singing without copies is the norm I still think it is a feat and it taxes the ageing memory capacity. And I say this a week away from singing in a 200 strong Cornish Choir at Birminhgham Symphony Hall. But what a lovely thing to be doing!

[Keraulophone]

Agreed but I think the optional low B flat in the basses is worth making a fuss about though . Any one done it?

Yes! RPO/Brighton Festival Chorus/Lawrence Foster at the RFH, late 1970s. I don't think it's 'optional' as such - Mahler wanted it sung, but clearly there's the octave higher also in the score for those who can't reach down there. MS:



The Brighton choir of that era had some deep basses. They sang a semitone lower (i.e. three ledger lines below the bass clef) in Kodaly's Psalmus Hungaricus in the LSO recording for Decca conducted by Kertez. It was before I joined their ranks, but apparently when the bottom A emerged, some astonished faces among the double bass section were looking around to see where the note was coming from!
.

[EnemyoftheStoat]

Agreed but I think the optional low Bflat in the basses is worth making a fuss about though . Any one done it? I can get to E Nat but Bflat ? In the next life perhaps .

Yep. C is my normal lowest note of any value. The B flat needs several Guinnesses and a couple of red wines, though. Incidentally I once sang next to a pro - in some other piece - who had been contracted specifically for low stuff. His method of getting there was a cigar or two the night before.

[EnemyoftheStoat]

I don't think any chorus has sung Mahler 2 for at least two years and, because of Covid, chorus members have dropped out / felt reluctant to be in a big group, so the choral scene is not yet as it once was.
RJ

There was a Philharmonia Mahler 2 not long ago. And besides, if you sing something from memory that frequently, it sticks. I did bits of Szymanowski's Stabat Mater at a Prom and other gigs from memory years ago, and it's still there.

[Barbirollians]

Organ nerd warning! Earlier mention was made of seeing so many stops drawn at the console. At the RAH to make maximum 'noise' you would need no more a dozen stops drawn! For me, the organ didn't make the overwhelming contribution it should, because the heaviest and deepest pedal stops didn't seem to be engaged ... the big 16' and 32' Bombardes (or whatever they are called there). In the CBSO /Stenz performance in Symphony Hall they were all gloriously present, underpinning the whole texture wonderfully, and helping to bring that performance to a thrilling conclusion. In Birmingham the CBSO chorus (unaided and without copies!) made THE most magical entry, quadruple piano.
RJ

A thrilling conclusion indeed after five cool calculated and clinical movements - the performance only took off with the CBSO chorus.

[Barbirollians]

I was at Symphony Hall but listened to the Rattle only on Sounds - Rattle hands down for me - despite the excellence of the orchestra,chorus and soloists in Birmingham.

[Ein Heldenleben]

A thrilling conclusion indeed after five cool calculated and clinical movements - the performance only took off with the CBSO chorus.

Sorry Barbs - are you referring to the Stenz or Rattle perf?

[Alison]

Sorry Barbs - are you referring to the Stenz or Rattle perf?

Stenz