Prom 26: Semyon Bychkov and the Labèque Sisters (5.08.22)

[Joseph K]

Essentially, your last sentence crystallises the difference between us: I think that there’s precious little of the ‘echt’ Julian Anderson left once you remove the blatant cribs and references to ‘les autres’. He’s a melange, but not a blancmange, for he wears Joseph’s Coat of Many Colours. ‘ The Colourful Spectralist?’

I'm currently near the end of listening to the piece in its entirety (it's just finished in fact). I'll admit, I didn't really enjoy it as much as the first time round - although I have a couple of his CDs, I haven't listened to them in a long time. I guess, despite his music's distinctiveness, its novelty at least for me wears off fairly quickly.. I didn't find it that engaging.

[makropulos]

I'm currently near the end of listening to the piece in its entirety (it's just finished in fact). I'll admit, I didn't really enjoy it as much as the first time round - although I have a couple of his CDs, I haven't listened to them in a long time. I guess, despite his music's distinctiveness, its novelty at least for me wears off fairly quickly.. I didn't find it that engaging.

Coincidentally I've just had a listen to the broadcast, having been in the hall for the performance on Friday. If anything I enjoyed it even more second time around, so this is clearly a case of each-to-their-own. I found it wonderfully colourful (as we expect from JA) but also throughly coherent too –I can't think of many other new Proms pieces which have held my attention so completely for half and hour –and the same happened when I reheard it tonight. As to borrowings from earlier composers mentioned in some posts, I don't have the slightest problem, since the end result sounds distinctively like Anderson to me, in spite of allusions in this piece to Stravinsky (in particular). I suppose we can argue its merits till the cows come home, but my reaction has been overwhelmingly positive.

[Maclintick]

Coincidentally I've just had a listen to the broadcast, having been in the hall for the performance on Friday. If anything I enjoyed it even more second time around, so this is clearly a case of each-to-their-own. I found it wonderfully colourful (as we expect from JA) but also throughly coherent too –I can't think of many other new Proms pieces which have held my attention so completely for half and hour –and the same happened when I reheard it tonight. As to borrowings from earlier composers mentioned in some posts, I don't have the slightest problem, since the end result sounds distinctively like Anderson to me, in spite of allusions in this piece to Stravinsky (in particular). I suppose we can argue its merits till the cows come home, but my reaction has been overwhelmingly positive.

I agree with you & Joseph K. I suppose it's inevitable that an essentially "approachable" piece will be condemned by whoever considers themselves to be the cognoscenti/avant-garde these days (whatever that means) but to reference the "cribs" or influences adduced by Edashtav, I found JA's piece more enjoyable than recent offerings from either of the contemporary composers he mentions.

[edashtav]

Coincidentally I've just had a listen to the broadcast, having been in the hall for the performance on Friday. If anything I enjoyed it even more second time around, so this is clearly a case of each-to-their-own. I found it wonderfully colourful (as we expect from JA) but also throughly coherent too –I can't think of many other new Proms pieces which have held my attention so completely for half and hour –and the same happened when I reheard it tonight. As to borrowings from earlier composers mentioned in some posts, I don't have the slightest problem, since the end result sounds distinctively like Anderson to me, in spite of allusions in this piece to Stravinsky (in particular). I suppose we can argue its merits till the cows come home, but my reaction has been overwhelmingly positive.

“Thoroughly coherent” : I’m glad you’ve mentioned structure, Makropulos, because that virtue did shine through the welter of notes in a manner that reminded me of Max Reger. But then,… but then, its sheer Baxian lushness is my abiding memory. I think Robin Holloway explores the New Romanticism in a fresher, leaner fashion. There’s a real composer lurking inside Julian Anderson, but, at present, he’s a chameleon, a dedicated follower of Hans Werner Henze.

[RichardB]

I suppose it's inevitable that an essentially "approachable" piece will be condemned by whoever considers themselves to be the cognoscenti/avant-garde these days

Not really. There's no single-dimensional scale between "approachable" and "avant-garde", whatever either of those terms is supposed to mean. I haven't listened to this piece yet, being currently away on holiday, but the disagreements here about it have encouraged me to do so! It is encouraging to see a Proms commission that's more substantial than the usual potboilers, less so to see that it comes from one of the "usual suspects".

[edashtav]

Not really. There's no single-dimensional scale between "approachable" and "avant-garde", whatever either of those terms is supposed to mean. I haven't listened to this piece yet, being currently away on holiday, but the disagreements here about it have encouraged me to do so! It is encouraging to see a Proms commission that's more substantial than the usual potboilers, less so to see that it comes from one of the "usual suspects".

It is encouraging to see a Proms commission that's more substantial than the usual potboilers, less so to see that it comes from one of the "usual suspects"

Yes, indeed, Richard. Whilst the Beeb fathered an extended work with loads of notes, I fear it failed to get its money worth in terms of originality or significance. Two older works with Prague in their names have more substance and gristle.

[Pulcinella]

It is encouraging to see a Proms commission that's more substantial than the usual potboilers, less so to see that it comes from one of the "usual suspects"

Yes, indeed, Richard. Whilst the Beeb fathered an extended work with loads of notes, I fear it failed to get its money worth in terms of originality or significance. Two older works with Prague in their names have more substance and gristle.

Would either of you like to start a Julian Anderson thread in our Composers section?
I wasn't really concentrating on Friday, tuning in more for the Martinu, but I'm more inclined to listen again now, though!
I have two CDs of his music (Book of hours etc on NMC and Alhambra Fantasy etc on Ondine), which I must dig out and listen to again too; I can't remember any piece on those CDs making that much of an impression, apart from one that has distorted bell-like sounds which I thought at first were a fault in the recording and didn't want to subject myself to again!

[edashtav]

Would either of you like to start a Julian Anderson thread in our Composers section?
I wasn't really concentrating on Friday, tuning in more for the Martinu, but I'm more inclined to listen again now, though!
I have two CDs of his music (Book of hours etc on NMC and Alhambra Fantasy etc on Ondine), which I must dig out and listen to again too; I can't remember any piece on those CDs making that much of an impression, apart from one that has distorted bell-like sounds which I thought at first were a fault in the recording and didn't want to subject myself to again!

I’m afraid its a ‘No’ from me, Pulcie, because such threads are better started by enthusiasts rather than detractors.
There are composers that I’d like to propose when I have the time.

[Joseph K]

Would either of you like to start a Julian Anderson thread in our Composers section?
I wasn't really concentrating on Friday, tuning in more for the Martinu, but I'm more inclined to listen again now, though!
I have two CDs of his music (Book of hours etc on NMC and Alhambra Fantasy etc on Ondine), which I must dig out and listen to again too; I can't remember any piece on those CDs making that much of an impression, apart from one that has distorted bell-like sounds which I thought at first were a fault in the recording and didn't want to subject myself to again!

Done.

[Pulcinella]

I’m afraid its a ‘No’ from me, Pulcie, because such threads are better started by enthusiasts rather than detractors.
There are composers that I’d like to propose when I have the time.

Understood: it was primarily a thought to enable the discussion to continue other than on this specific Proms thread, and I didn't feel I knew enough to initiate it myself.

Done.

[Maclintick]

“Thoroughly coherent” : I’m glad you’ve mentioned structure, Makropulos, because that virtue did shine through the welter of notes in a manner that reminded me of Max Reger. But then,… but then, its sheer Baxian lushness is my abiding memory. I think Robin Holloway explores the New Romanticism in a fresher, leaner fashion. There’s a real composer lurking inside Julian Anderson, but, at present, he’s a chameleon, a dedicated follower of Hans Werner Henze.

Stylistic chameleons are exotic flowers, Ed, if not exactly rare. I'm not sure whether JA would agree that he's "a dedicated follower of Hans Werner Henze", & I can't for the life of me perceive all the "cribs" that you assert are present in this Prague Panorama (in which Henze didn't figure IIRC) but of influences, sure, the Stravinsky of Les Noces -- rather than the Rachmaninov of The Bells, if that is what you had in mind -- and among latter influences a solid kinship with Knussen, in terms of orchestration, pellucid sonorities, & rhythmic vibrancy -- I'm thinking here particularly of OK's small ensemble pieces 2 Organa & Ophelia Dances. Henze is of course out of fashion currently, & it's an interesting conjecture as to whether he'll ever significantly re-enter the repertory, either in his adopted home here or in Germany, where his follower Detlev Glanert is regularly no-platformed by the musical establishment.

More on track, I wonder if Makropulos might provide some info as to whether JA has specifically referenced Czech composers in his symphony...I couldn't discern any...

[edashtav]

Knussen… yes, indeed!