Prom 75 - 9.09.17: Last Night of the Proms

[pastoralguy]

Are Proms seasons shorter in recent years? I've tried using the Proms Archive to research this - but I don't think my lifespan will last the amount of time needed to navigate the website - but I remember that the Birtwistle Panic Last Night was the equivalent of a week later (16th Sept) and a Live broadcast of the Colin Davis Prom occurred after the Monday 11th September 2001 attacks on the Twin Towers, so, again, the Last Night would have been on Sat 16th September . Did those seasons with an "extra week" begin later, or has there been a reduction in weeks of concerts?

I know this is a candidate for Pedants Corner but the attack on the Twin Towers was a Tuesday. I can still remember coming out of our weekly Multi-disciplinary meeting to be told that a plane had hit ONE of the Towers, giving the impression that it was a terrible accident. How the world has changed since then.

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

I know this is a candidate for Pedants Corner but the attack on the Twin Towers was a Tuesday.

Indeed - and the Last Night Saturday would have been 15th, not 16th as I stated.

[pastoralguy]

Indeed - and the Last Night Saturday would have been 15th, not 16th as I stated.

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

2001 season began on July 20 and ran to Sept 15.

as a random comparison, 1970 ran from July 17 to Sept 12.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/events/r66dgw/series

Just google Proms season archive 1970.

- forget #42 - by coincidence I just happened to remember two Last Nights that began in years where the Season started a week later than this year's did. (I used to have my main holiday in the middle two weeks of September, and I can vividly remember where I watched the 1995 and 2001 Last Nights.)

[Pabmusic]

... and what is your excuse / defence for having or having had such an LP?


.

I too owned a copy. No need for an excuse. :)

[Darkbloom]

Are Proms seasons shorter in recent years? I've tried using the Proms Archive to research this - but I don't think my lifespan will last the amount of time needed to navigate the website - but I remember that the Birtwistle Panic Last Night was the equivalent of a week later (16th Sept) and a Live broadcast of the Colin Davis Prom occurred after the Monday 11th September 2001 attacks on the Twin Towers, so, again, the Last Night would have been on Sat 16th September . Did those seasons with an "extra week" begin later, or has there been a reduction in weeks of concerts?

I had this thought too, but the season never has a fixed starting date, just mid-July-ish, so I assumed that was the reason this season feels truncated. I'm sure I'm one among many who feels that the season goes on a bit too long anyway, but they presumably have to run into September to catch the more prestigious touring orchestras, who usually aren't available until late-August.

[Petrushka]

I had this thought too, but the season never has a fixed starting date, just mid-July-ish, so I assumed that was the reason this season feels truncated. I'm sure I'm one among many who feels that the season goes on a bit too long anyway, but they presumably have to run into September to catch the more prestigious touring orchestras, who usually aren't available until late-August.

The oldest printed Proms Guide I have is that from 1971 when there were a total of just 54 concerts running from July 23 to September 18. Don't forget that in those days there were no Sunday concerts while were there three late night Proms. Needless to say, there were no musicals or such like.

In my opinion, the Proms has become too bloated. The 6.30 starts are ridiculous and there are far too many late nighters. I'd much prefer to see a slimming down, mostly concentrating on what we can recognise as 'classical music' and with the vast majority of concerts beginning at 7.30.

[Eine Alpensinfonie]

The oldest printed Proms Guide I have is that from 1971 when there were a total of just 54 concerts running from July 23 to September 18. Don't forget that in those days there were no Sunday concerts while were there three late night Proms. Needless to say, there were no musicals or such like.

.

But there were G & S evenings, broadcast on Radio 2 until a certain date.

[Petrushka]

But there were G & S evenings, broadcast on Radio 2 until a certain date.

On Aug 28 in 1971 but I wouldn't myself have classed G&S as a 'musical'. Operetta, surely.

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

On Aug 28 in 1971 but I wouldn't myself have classed G&S as a 'musical'. Operetta, surely.

G&S Evenings were an annual(-ish) feature for many years - until about the time that D'Oyly Carte lost its Arts Council funding in the early '80s.

What would you say are the principal differences between "Operetta" and "Musical", incidentally?

[Petrushka]

What would you say are the principal differences between "Operetta" and "Musical", incidentally?

A thorny question and one difficult to answer as the line is so frequently blurred between the two. I can only answer it with examples by saying that Die Fledermaus is an operetta, G&S is operetta, Rodgers & Hammerstein, Stephen Sondheim and Leonard Bernstein etc are musicals. Perhaps the word 'musical' is the American version of the more European 'operetta'. Perhaps time and geography are the real differences as one just seems to morph into the other. All I can do sorry.

[Serial_Apologist]

G&S Evenings were an annual(-ish) feature for many years - until about the time that D'Oyly Carte lost its Arts Council funding in the early '80s.

What would you say are the principal differences between "Operetta" and "Musical", incidentally?

To me, operetta is the lighter end of opera, whereas musicals are staged or filmed plays with plots interrupted by annoying dance episodes and/or cast members suddenly and inexplicably breaking into song. If you did this in the Croydon shopping precinct you'd probably be asked why you weren't selling the Big Issue instead.

[MrGongGong]

G&S Evenings were an annual(-ish) feature for many years - until about the time that D'Oyly Carte lost its Arts Council funding in the early '80s.

One of their better decisions IMV

[Prommer]

Who is singing Rule, Britannia? Ms Stemme I had assumed...? Lucy Crowe also on hand...

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

A thorny question and one difficult to answer as the line is so frequently blurred between the two. I can only answer it with examples by saying that Die Fledermaus is an operetta, G&S is operetta, Rodgers & Hammerstein, Stephen Sondheim and Leonard Bernstein etc are musicals. Perhaps the word 'musical' is the American version of the more European 'operetta'. Perhaps time and geography are the real differences as one just seems to morph into the other. All I can do sorry.

No need to be sorry, Pet - that's more or less how I'd sum it up.