Prom 46 - 19.08.17: Schoenberg – Gurrelieder

[Petrushka]

My first Proms Gurrelieder was in 1987 with the National Youth Orchestra of Great Briiain and Pierre Boulez referred to above. A fantastic evening! Alas my video recording died the death long ago. Needless to say, I will be there on Saturday.

My favourite was the 1994 First Night, BBCSO/Davis, that included Hans Hotter as the Speaker. I was lucky enough to meet him after the concert when he signed my programme. One enterprising individual had bought along the LP booklet from Solti's Walküre for signature. If that was you, well done.

The first entry of the massed male chorus ('Holla!') is spine-tingling in live performance and I'm sure it will be again.

[Darkbloom]

My first Proms Gurrelieder was in 1987 with the National Youth Orchestra of Great Briiain and Pierre Boulez referred to above. A fantastic evening! Alas my video recording died the death long ago. Needless to say, I will be there on Saturday.

My favourite was the 1994 First Night, BBCSO/Davis, that included Hans Hotter as the Speaker. I was lucky enough to meet him after the concert when he signed my programme. One enterprising individual had bought along the LP booklet from Solti's Walküre for signature. If that was you, well done.

The first entry of the massed male chorus ('Holla!') is spine-tingling in live performance and I'm sure it will be again.

Can you recall whether Hotter sang the last word 'sonne' at the Proms? I heard him do it on a recording, and when you hear other speakers it never quite works for me when it's just spoken.

[Petrushka]

Can you recall whether Hotter sang the last word 'sonne' at the Proms? I heard him do it on a recording, and when you hear other speakers it never quite works for me when it's just spoken.

He did, yes, a wonderful moment!

[BBMmk2]

I know the blurbs are not written by Alpie, but Moses & Aron is Arnie's Tristan & Isolde. Gurrelieder is his Flying Dutchman.

Sujrely it's Gurre Lieder should be Tristan & Isolde?

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

Sujrely it's Gurre Lieder should be Tristan & Isolde?

Well, I'm the first to agree that Arnie was a genius from the very start, but if Tristan marks one of the pinnacles of Wagner's art (and communicating his deepest philosophical musings), then Moses is the equivalent in Schönberg's. (Gurrelieder is the work of a great thirty-year-old composer showing complete mastery of an established Musical language, but not yet creating the sound of his best works - the works that altered the history of Musical expression - which is why, pace Darkbloom's suggestion, I put The Flying Dutchman as the Wagnerian "equivalent".)

[Promgoer]

Ah - JB is "still" credited as the conductor on the Proms Archive website.


So do I. (My own going, that is - not yours. Unless you were wearing a very seventies floral shirt, in which case I do remember you - you were sat in front of me. I remember seeing a pair of youngish chaps on the other side of the Hall following the performance with an enormous score. Must have driven their neighbours mad!)

I'll come clean. I was wearing black trousers and shoes, a white shirt and an NYO tie...

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

I'll come clean. I was wearing black trousers and shoes, a white shirt and an NYO tie...

I think I may have seen you after all, then! A tremendous concert - as soon as the Prelude started, floral shirts vanished from my attention.

[BBMmk2]

Well, I'm the first to agree that Arnie was a genius from the very start, but if Tristan marks one of the pinnacles of Wagner's art (and communicating his deepest philosophical musings), then Moses is the equivalent in Schönberg's. (Gurrelieder is the work of a great thirty-year-old composer showing complete mastery of an established Musical language, but not yet creating the sound of his best works - the works that altered the history of Musical expression - which is why, pace Darkbloom's suggestion, I put The Flying Dutchman as the Wagnerian "equivalent".)

Ah right, fair enough. Although I still think of this, as several more knowledgeable people, have said this.. Which to me makes sense. But I see your point as well!

[Prommer]

Looking forward to this. But why is the TV not relaying this live? Have to wait till 3rd September...for which, deo gratias - but still...

[BBMmk2]

Looking forward to this. But why is the TV not relaying this live? Have to wait till 3rd September...for which, deo gratias - but still...

The relays seem to be done different to how they used o be. I think, iirr, there are fewer?

[Stanfordian]

Looking forward to this. But why is the TV not relaying this live? Have to wait till 3rd September...for which, deo gratias - but still...

I guess the powers that be think that Gurrelieder has little popular appeal!

[Serial_Apologist]

I guess the powers that be think that Gurrelieder has little popular appeal!

[bluestateprommer]

Well, that was quite the glorious noise, and presumably a modest sign of things to come when SSR takes full charge at the LSO. At least on iPlayer, it was notable how much SSR refined the LSO's sound to balance well with Simon O'Neill and Eva-Maria Westbroek in Part I. When it was time to full throttle in the orchestration, then Rattle did so, but without ever letting it get out of control that I could tell. I'll admit that O'Neill's tenor was an acquired taste, IMHO, in its timbre. I assume that TQ had a head-mike for his section, unless he spoke into a stage microphone. Will be interesting to hear from people who were in the RAH.

The Proms Extra talk is going on now; worth a listen or visit-back if anyone isn't listening rat the moment.

[Darkbloom]

Well, that was quite the glorious noise, and presumably a modest sign of things to come when SSR takes full charge at the LSO. At least on iPlayer, it was notable how much SSR refined the LSO's sound to balance well with Simon O'Neill and Eva-Maria Westbroek in Part I. When it was time to full throttle in the orchestration, then Rattle did so, but without ever letting it get out of control that I could tell. I'll admit that O'Neill's tenor was an acquired taste, IMHO, in its timbre. I assume that TQ had a head-mike for his section, unless he spoke into a stage microphone. Will be interesting to hear from people who were in the RAH.

The Proms Extra talk is going on now; worth a listen or visit-back if anyone isn't listening rat the moment.

I'd be surprised if Quasthoff had been wearing a microphone. He hasn't been retired long from a distinguished singing career, and now I think he's a stage actor, so projection would not be a problem.

Overall I found the performance impressive, but can't say it overwhelmed me. I don't know what the choir sounded like in the hall but it came across rather muddy on the radio.

O'Neill has one of those Jon Vickers Marmite voices, but I thought he was very good, somewhat better than Westbroek who sounded stretched. Cargill was excellent as the Wood Dove.

[Petrushka]

I was in G stalls again for this, at platform level and got the full force of the huge orchestra and when it went at full throttle it was pretty overwhelming, I can tell you.

Although on the other side of the stage I feel fairly sure that Quasthoff was amplified. Hotter wasn't in 1994.