Prom 19: 29.07.16 - David Bowie Prom

[Bumfluff]

Hmm, i haven't liked what ive seen either, but john cale may have just redeemed it.

Edit: And Anna Calvi too.

[bluestateprommer]

It's continuing on BBC Radio 6:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b07llc2d

I'll archive the full playlist on the Forum Calendar later.

[johncorrigan]

I really enjoyed it - thought the three songs in the middle from Black Star were really moving - Paul Buchanan really did a great job. The John Cale version of 'Sorrow' and in particular 'Space Oddity' with the gospel choir a real high point. Marc Almond crap...but he's always been totally p*** in my opinion. Also didn't enjoy the French singer, whoever he was, but thought the musicians in the orchestra did a top job throughout.

[Anastasius]

Who cares? Well:

http://www.philly.com/philly/columni...Orchestra.html

Oh please ! That justifies his place in the Pantheon of classical music ? Please - pull the other leg.

[french frank]

Oh please ! That justifies his place in the Pantheon of classical music ?

It would be bizarre to claim that this Prom was even intending to justify his place in 'the Pantheon of classical music'! It was intended to be a tribute Prom to one of the biggest names ever in the world of 'popular music' (defined as having megamillions of fans, selling megamillions of recordings and being saluted by many enthusiasts of 'non-popular' music, musicians and not). Those seem to me to be the most obvious reasons: the organisers may have had additional reasons.

Critically, the concert should be judged on its own merits, not on the basis of what, individually, one might think of the musician: Richard Morrison in the Times loved it … (thanks once again to my stalwart 'sharer' of Times articles).

[Bryn]

It's continuing on BBC Radio 6:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b07llc2d

I'll archive the full playlist on the Forum Calendar later.

Not complete in a single stretch on Radio 6 Music either. The very end is to be found at the start of the followiong programme. Also, Radio 6 Music is not available in HD Sound. It only uses just over a third of the data rate of Radio 3.

[There is an overlap of the end of the R6M iPlayer file for the Davis Bowie Prom and the following Nemone's Electric Ladyland programme, and edit points during appause are there for anyone wanting to sort it out, though the iPlayer team may resolve the issue eventually.]

Just to add that the audio engineering of Radios 3 and 6M are very different, R6M using significant dynamic compression resulting in a much more prominent ambient level.

[underthecountertenor]

Interesting reactions here. Two very different species of detractor: the 'Proms purist' for whom the very notion of a Bowie prom was always going to be anathema, and the Bowie devotee for whom the actuality of the concert as it turned out amounted almost to a desecration. Not surprisingly, the first weren't in evidence in the hall, but there were a few examples of the latter (including a stoned man in a hat with an affected Bowie drawl, who at one point shouted out 'f***ing idiots!')

I am no Bowie devotee (I would recognise maybe a dozen of his songs) but neither am I a Proms purist. I stayed after the wonderful Haitink Mahler 3 because I was attracted by the line-up of musicians (in particular stargaze) and arrangers (from Anna Meredith to the wonderful young composer Josephine Stephenson, and including the charismatic Jherek Bischoff). Coming at it from that angle, I thought it was a terrific concert. Not everything was wholly successful, and the concert could certainly have flowed better (André de Ridder struggled, perhaps unsurprisingly, with the task of linking the numbers whilst at the same time directing and performing in such a variety of arrangements and line-ups). But the virtuosity of stargaze shone through, as did the talents of the composer-arrangers, particularly those mentioned above.

An awkward night in some ways, chiefly because some of the Bowie stalwarts clearly didn't get what they expected or wanted. But, for me at least, this and the Mahler 3 made for a tremendously fulfilling evening in the RAH.

[Old Grumpy]

I really enjoyed it - thought the three songs in the middle from Black Star were really moving - Paul Buchanan really did a great job. The John Cale version of 'Sorrow' and in particular 'Space Oddity' with the gospel choir a real high point. Marc Almond crap...but he's always been totally p*** in my opinion. Also didn't enjoy the French singer, whoever he was, but thought the musicians in the orchestra did a top job throughout.

Good summary of my opinion too - I quite liked Philippe Jaroussky's contribution though.

OG

[Old Grumpy]

Who cares? What is precisely the relevance of DB to classical music?

Quite a lot of people, judging by the size and enthusiasm of the audience (as far as could be assessed from the TV).

The Proms are mainly, but no longer purely a classical music festival, if you had not noticed. They now come under the umbrella of BBC Music, rather then the Third Programme!

OG

[Stanfordian]

It would be bizarre to claim that this Prom was even intending to justify his place in 'the Pantheon of classical music'! It was intended to be a tribute Prom to one of the biggest names ever in the world of 'popular music' (defined as having megamillions of fans, selling megamillions of recordings and being saluted by many enthusiasts of 'non-popular' music, musicians and not). Those seem to me to be the most obvious reasons: the organisers may have had additional reasons.

Critically, the concert should be judged on its own merits, not on the basis of what, individually, one might think of the musician: Richard Morrison in the Times loved it … (thanks once again to my stalwart 'sharer' of Times articles).

Why put so much store on Richard Morrison's opinion? His view is no more worthy than anyone elses? In truth I'm far more interested in the opinions of contributors on this forum.

[Stanfordian]

Yes, everything the BBC does seems to be about broadening the appeal. And I suspect the audiance figures get lower and lower each year; but I may be wrong.

[Old Grumpy]

Interesting reactions here. Two very different species of detractor: the 'Proms purist' for whom the very notion of a Bowie prom was always going to be anathema, and the Bowie devotee for whom the actuality of the concert as it turned out amounted almost to a desecration. Not surprisingly, the first weren't in evidence in the hall, but there were a few examples of the latter (including a stoned man in a hat with an affected Bowie drawl, who at one point shouted out 'f***ing idiots!')

I am no Bowie devotee (I would recognise maybe a dozen of his songs) but neither am I a Proms purist. I stayed after the wonderful Haitink Mahler 3 because I was attracted by the line-up of musicians (in particular stargaze) and arrangers (from Anna Meredith to the wonderful young composer Josephine Stephenson, and including the charismatic Jherek Bischoff). Coming at it from that angle, I thought it was a terrific concert. Not everything was wholly successful, and the concert could certainly have flowed better (André de Ridder struggled, perhaps unsurprisingly, with the task of linking the numbers whilst at the same time directing and performing in such a variety of arrangements and line-ups). But the virtuosity of stargaze shone through, as did the talents of the composer-arrangers, particularly those mentioned above.

An awkward night in some ways, chiefly because some of the Bowie stalwarts clearly didn't get what they expected or wanted. But, for me at least, this and the Mahler 3 made for a tremendously fulfilling evening in the RAH.

Yes, stargaze were superb, I thought.

[underthecountertenor]

Who cares? What is precisely the relevance of DB to classical music?

What, precisely, do you mean by 'classical music'?
And why do you believe (as your question implies) that every single one of the 75 proms this year (plus the fringe concerts) should be devoted to whatever it is you do mean by 'classical music'?

[french frank]

Why put so much store on Richard Morrison's opinion? His view is no more worthy than anyone elses? In truth I'm far more interested in the opinions of contributors on this forum.

I didn't place any store in it whatsoever. I merely reported it because the Times article was 'shared' with me this morning, I read it and I thought the fact that he enjoyed it, as an individual (the point I was making) was interesting and relevant.

I wonder whether utct classes me as a Proms purist or a Bowie devotee, since they seemed to be the 'binaries'! What I do think is, tangentially, depressing is that it takes a Bowie tribute Prom for the wider BBC to report a Proms concert at all (they may have reported the SCD Prom - I can't remember). That's goes a long way toward cementing the idea in the public's mind that classical music (and the Proms most of the time) are 'elitist'.

[underthecountertenor]

I wonder whether utct classes me as a Proms purist or a Bowie devotee, since they seemed to be the 'binaries'! What I do think is, tangentially, depressing is that it takes a Bowie tribute Prom for the wider BBC to report a Proms concert at all (they may have reported the SCD Prom - I can't remember). That's goes a long way toward cementing the idea in the public's mind that classical music (and the Proms most of the time) are 'elitist'.

I didn't (and don't) put you in either category, as I understood that you were commenting not on the concert itself but on the publicity for it. Your reference to the review by Morrison (not a critic I particularly admire, if such a thing exists) rather suggested to me that you were open-minded about the concert itself (unlike, perhaps, the person who criticised you for referring to it!)