Prom 7: 20.07.16 - Faure, Stravinsky and Poulenc

[antongould]

A decent Prom. Good performances, not too hot in the hall. Shame about the patron sat to my right who dozed off 5 mins into Shylock and started snoring prodigiously...

OMG ..... more than a shame I would say ..... I really enjoyed the Prom, it brought the sun back to these parts ....

[Pulcinella]

A decent Prom. Good performances, not too hot in the hall. Shame about the patron sat to my right who dozed off 5 mins into Shylock and started snoring prodigiously...

Did the conductor's attention to precise instrumental placement (position on stage) and the fact that some of the players were standing (which we were kindly informed of on Radio 3) make any diffference to the way the sound came across in the hall, do you think, buffy?

[edashtav]

I'm growing to love Poulenc's Stabat Mater and Minkowski's performance last evening did it justice. I felt too tired by high humidity and heat last evening to analyse why and I must admit that it's multi-movement form and the kaleidoscopic nature of Poulenc's inspiration makes for difficulties - it's easy to cherry pick ripe moments and fail to find the overall shape, structure and meaning. So, it's good to be guided by ears as richly experienced, sympathetic and informed as Jayne's.

I'm amazed to learn from Bryn that Klemperer introduced Pulcinella to the Soviet Union. The one moment from his LP with the Philharmonia that I shall never forget is the manner in which he turned the duo of trombone and double bass into a slow, stately chorale suitable for the Entry of the Soviet President.

[Pulcinella]

According to EWW the 1947 revision is textually almost identical to the original but with added metronome markings and with the Duette retitled as Vivo. It was Klemperer who intoduced Pulcinella to the Soviet Union.

Thanks Bryn.
It's the duet (Vivo) between double bass and trombone that is so deliciously OTT in that Klemperer recording.
There is a review of a reissue c/w a previously unreleased Petrushka here:

http://www.gramophone.co.uk/review/stravinsky-petrushka-pulcinella-suite

[EnemyoftheStoat]

Anyone else sick of "edited to death" recordings being compared with the live fare on offer at the Proms.

[mrbouffant]

Did the conductor's attention to precise instrumental placement (position on stage) and the fact that some of the players were standing (which we were kindly informed of on Radio 3) make any diffference to the way the sound came across in the hall, do you think, buffy?

Buffy?!

Didn't really make a lot of difference to me, but then again I was sat miles away in Circle T Row 1. Visually it was very interesting to see the soloists bounce up and down as they played.

[Pulcinella]

Buffy?!

No offence intended; think I got you confused with suffy!

[Maclintick]

Looking back at my #9, I can't make out any Proms/New Releases comparisons going on....(but what's wrong with comparing recordings to live relays anyway, at the very least from a stylistic/interpretative viewpoint?)

.... anyway Mac, have you heard the BIS/Tapiola/Suzuki Stravinsky set? Where do these deadly edits supposedly fall?

Fair point re your #9, JLW -- & thanks for your review of last night's Prom which I've yet to sample on I-Player. I was attempting in a more general way to express the vague irritation I experience when discussion on a live performance thread morphs into "But of course OK's version recorded in 1965 with the Ensemble der Rumpelstilzchen Hochschule für Musik, or somesuch, has to be the ultimate benchmark". That's just me. Please carry on.

On your second point -- no, I haven't heard the BIS set to which you refer, but I'm sure Rob Suff & his excellent team will have ensured that no edits are audible, no matter how many there are. Suggestions that the Proms should have dropped the Faure Shylock Suite, which has but one ropey old 1961 mono incarnation in the recorded catalogue as far as my limited research indicates, & very few live performances in between, fill me with despair....

[jayne lee wilson]

Revisiting the Pulcinella Suite off of the iPlayer I can only concur with Ed - what a lovely performance! A very French 1920s feel from Minkowski again, playful yet relaxed (perhaps a shade too relaxed, lapsing a little into neoclassic autopilot, in the gavotta) a warmly laid-back summer-evening feel from the BBC Ensemble with a brilliantly enlivening piccolo arriving every so often to shake us out of our easy contentment. It did indeed sound different from Stravinsky's own recordings, as does Suzuki, so much the fresher for it too...

Very attractive acoustic presentation, closer-set for the smaller ensemble, that distinctive RAH sound without the rapid reflections off sidewalls. Hopefully the Cercle De l'harmonie will get similarly sympathetic treatment tonight...

(I wouldn't worry about being called Buffy, Mr. Bouffant. Great name anyway & The Vampire Slayer was a great show. Remember Spike? Spike was great. Had a great death too.)

[edashtav]

My Suzuki Pulcinella has arrived sparkling in the summer sunshine like the chromium on a new motorbike. So far, I've road-tested its Sinfonia. It's refulgent with baroque devices, ones that MS and MM have absorbed over their lifetimes of study. Poor Igor lived too soon to have seen his music through such refracting prisms, but knowing his fascination with such matters, had he lived, he'd be preparing Pulcinella, copyright 2016 which would turn accepted HIP norms on their head. Such fun!

Did I hear the Prom's marvellous interval talk correctly? I thought that of the speakers suggested that Igor's Pulcinella was his bonsai tree, whilst Le Sacre was a much larger arboreal beast.

[Bryn]

Still not made my mind up as to whether to buy the Suzuki Pulcinella Suite. I'm currently listening to the CSO/Boulez 'live' recording of the complete ballet from 2009 (CSO-Resound). Easily my favourite among the various recordings of the work I have.

[edashtav]

I sense that Boarders are warming to Faure's very Gallic music for Shylock - a score rarely performed and infrequently recorded. It might be fascinating to draw comparisons with Edward German's light "Tudorbethan" Incidental music , some of which was exactly contemporaneous with Faure's suite. I felt that Marc Minkowski brought out the quiet beauty and harmonic subtlety of Faure's score and he may have improved its balance by altering the order of its movements. Shylock is no show stopper but it's the type of gentle music that benefits from being on CD and ready to spin when one is in the right mood. MM could be the ideal conductor to create a disc to fill a hole in the recorded repertoire.

[edashtav]

Still not made my mind up as to whether to buy the Suzuki Pulcinella. I'm currently listening to the CSO/Boulez 'live' recordings from 2009 (CSO-Resound). Easily my favourite among the various recordings of the work I have.

Thanks for that "Heads-Up", Bryn. once I've mastered Suzuki, I look forward to comparing it with Boulez.

[Daniel]

Did the conductor's attention to precise instrumental placement (position on stage) and the fact that some of the players were standing (which we were kindly informed of on Radio 3) make any diffference to the way the sound came across in the hall, do you think, buffy?

My impression was yes, if for no other reason than being visually separated made one listen out for them differently.

I enjoyed this concert very much. The Poulenc is such an unusual piece, something of a daydream of religiosity whilst dozing in the theatre perhaps? Could say more, but have to dash.

[Pulcinella]

Each to their own, of course, but Christopher Dingle, in September's BBC MM, which has just dropped through the letter box, doesn't think much to the new Suzuki release.
Only two stars for performance and three for recording.

Amongst other things, he claims that the edges of the rhythms have been smoothed; he also says that the recording gives the sense of space, but that of an aircraft hangar, with the orchestra down the other end.