Prom 1: 15.07.16 - First Night of the Proms

[edashtav]

Can I put in a dissenting note regarding the Elgar? I was very disappointed with the performance, especially the last two movements. Sol Gabetta pulled the music ... I may be in a minority but I prefer Elgar to be performed in a "straight" way. I have heard many performances and recordings of the cello concerto and Paul Watkin's is my favourite of recent recordings. He and Paul Tortelier show that the piece works as written!

Whilst I disagree with you re Sol's performance which I found to be a breath of fresh Argentinian air, having just acquired a CD of Tortelier's interpretation, I agree that Elgar brought the best out of PT.
However, is his version as true to the score as you claim? I find it delightfully idiosyncratic and full of French "Je ne sais quoi".

[Barbirollians]

Torteller's excellent recording with Sargent is much better than the recording with Boult which is very staid it sounds like a serious overreaction to Du Pre. I should much rather hear a slightly over emotional Elgar Cello Concerto performance than a dreary staid account .

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

I should much rather hear a slightly over emotional Elgar Cello Concerto performance than a dreary staid account .

I think, on balance, that I would, too (though my real preference is for neither) - but I don't find the Boult/Tortelier recording at all "staid", and certainly not "dreary". There is a stoicism about it that I find very dignified and (because of that) moving.

You've mentioned the Sargent recording before - I've always been put off getting it because of the Gerontius coupling (love the work, can't cope with Heddle Nash). I've found an MP3 download for pennies, so shall investigate that.

[edashtav]

I find the debate between staid and emotional fascinating in regard to Elgar's works as a whole and the Cello Concerto , in particular for I find that I can respond positively to performances that lean towards either of these descriptions.

I think that's because I view Elgar as an ambivalent fellow, a buttoned-up chap whose heart keeps appearing on his sleeve, a Remainer who might have campaigned for Brexit, a Catholic who could have fitted into the CoE , and an artist who would have loved to be a Chemist ( like me!). I salute Elgar's duality and love to hear versions that challenge my pre-conceived notions of whether this passage or that movement are buttoned-up or wildly emotional.

The idea of a first half containing the unbridled Russian romanticism of Tchaikovsky alongside the almost embarrassed Englishman was a clever concept. However, putting the mechanical, Soviet Prokofiev in "Robotnik" mood in the second half did SP's tawdry cantata no favours, at all.

[pastoralguy]

I've really tried to like Prokofiev's 'Nevsky' cantata but, despite having played it at least three times, I've never warmed to it. Imvho, third rate Prokofiev.

[Serial_Apologist]

I've really tried to like Prokofiev's 'Nevsky' cantata but, despite having played it at least three times, I've never warmed to it. Imvho, third rate Prokofiev.

For better Prokofiev in "socialist realist" mode, I'd recommend going for either the "Cantata for the Twentieth Anniversary of the October Revolution", despite the best bits being in the first half (not the reason it was banned); or "The Salute", a eulogy for Stalin which would be wonderful had its dedicatee also been.

[Lordgeous]

I too thought the cellist was superb, and what an imaginative encore; the R & J rather run of the mill, the Prokovief not one of his best, the BBC's normally splendid sound rather dry (on TV at least, listening through my high quallty audio setup), but KD!!! I don't know why there's something so annoying about her manner but she could at least wait a few seconds at the end of a piece before leaping in immediately over the applause, which to me is all part of the atmosphere and enjoyment of a live concert. The way the audience erupted many years ago at the end of a Boult Elgar 1 still gives me thrill! BTW would't a blind listener be able to tell 'the audience were still applauding"?!

[Barbirollians]

I think, on balance, that I would, too (though my real preference is for neither) - but I don't find the Boult/Tortelier recording at all "staid", and certainly not "dreary". There is a stoicism about it that I find very dignified and (because of that) moving.

You've mentioned the Sargent recording before - I've always been put off getting it because of the Gerontius coupling (love the work, can't cope with Heddle Nash). I've found an MP3 download for pennies, so shall investigate that.

I don't believe by any means it is one or the other . I am also a big fan of the Navarra and the first Isserlis neither of which go for the all out heart on the sleeve approach.

[edashtav]

For better Prokofiev in "socialist realist" mode, I'd recommend going for either the "Cantata for the Twentieth Anniversary of the October Revolution", despite the best bits being in the first half (not the reason it was banned); or "The Salute", a eulogy for Stalin which would be wonderful had its dedicatee also been.

Whilst I agree the Prokofiev's October Revolution cantata is a finer score than his Nevsky effort, I still feel, to use pastoral guy' s metric it's second-rate; it is overblown, akin to Soviet posters in its broad brush approach,and generally crammed to its gills with rodomontade. I'm ashamed to admit to never having heard "The Salute" but your recommendation is sufficient: I've added it to my "to do" list. Thanks.

[BBMmk2]

Generally, I love Prok's Nevsky. Sakari Oramo brought out all the score's qualities, brilliantly. This, I know is a propaganda work, but I think, like in Shosta's cantata The Song of the Forests, brings out more, than just a Soviet propaganda work.

[edashtav]

Generally, I love Prok's Nevsky. Sakari Oramo brought out all the score's qualities, brilliantly. This, I know is a propaganda work, but I think, like in Shosta's cantata The Song of the Forests, brings out more, than just a Soviet propaganda work.

Oh, to have your charity, bbm: I have tried hard to find solid virtues in the two Soviet cantatas that you commend but have found mainly dross. However, I agree with you, Sakari Oramo characterised the Prokofiev extremely well without revealing more than mere sounding brass.

The Last Night is the home for musical trivia, the First Night should be its mirror image: a reserve for masterworks.

[pastoralguy]

Whilst I agree the Prokofiev's October Revolution cantata is a finer score than his Nevsky effort, I still feel, to use pastoral guy' s metric it's second-rate; it is overblown, akin to Soviet posters in its broad brush approach,and generally crammed to its gills with rodomontade. I'm ashamed to admit to never having heard "The Salute" but your recommendation is sufficient: I've added it to my "to do" list. Thanks.

I had to look up rodomontade! What a great word!

[seabright]

I've just been listening to the Rostropovich / Rozhdestvensky / LSO Elgar VC on You Tube from a 1965 RFH performance on BBC Legends. I wonder how it would go down with those who prefer a "staid" performance? At any rate, on You Tube it's had well over 9,600 "views", 52 "thumbs ups" and only 1 "thumbs down" ...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kK2KplpDLa8

Cellist and conductor had also played the work in Moscow the previous year, so they were familiar with it for their London performance. This too has been released on CD ('Russian Disc') though it doesn't yet seem to be on You Tube!

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

I'm back home, still beaming. I enjoyed the concert enormously. I can only complain of some really intrusive coughing. Other than that it was brilliant and emotional. I'm really happy I got to be a part of this. Glad you guys enjoyed the broadcast.

Great to hear this, Carlos - being in the Hall, with all that physical sound flooding through you, must have made for a very special experience.

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

I don't think that anyone has said that they "prefer a 'staid' performance" of the Elgar, seabright - CMP and I have both said that we prefer to hear it "straight" (which is a very different thing) and Barbi introduced the concept of "staidity" as something he'd prefer to avoid. I agreed, preferring "stoic" - and ed then commented on the "staid" and "emotional" opposition.



(And I think you mean "the Rostropovich / Rozhdestvensky / LSO Elgar CC"? )