Your wishes for 2016 (Music-related suggestions only please)

[Flosshilde]

The 2015 Proms may have only just passed into the history books, but it's never too early to start talking about next year.

Heavens - it's nearly as bad as Christmas.

[Ferretfancy]

I missed an opportunity! After this year's Last Night I was taking a bus from the hall when a gentleman carrying a programme got on. I asked him if he had enjoyed it, and we chatted about the Proms, he seemed very interested in what I had thought of the season as a whole.

Just as I prepared to get off at my stop he said " I should declare an interest, you see, I'm planning next year's season !" I didn't have time to offer suggestions, but he did have time to tell me that there were plenty of gaps to fill.

[Serial_Apologist]

I missed an opportunity! After this year's Last Night I was taking a bus from the hall when a gentleman carrying a programme got on. I asked him if he had enjoyed it, and we chatted about the Proms, he seemed very interested in what I had thought of the season as a whole.

Just as I prepared to get off at my stop he said " I should declare an interest, you see, I'm planning next year's season !" I didn't have time to offer suggestions, but he did have time to tell me that there were plenty of gaps to fill.

He wasn't your dentist, by any chance, Ferret?

[Ferretfancy]

He wasn't your dentist, by any chance, Ferret?

No, but I did once have a dentist called Mr Phang -nominative determinism at work!

[teamsaint]

No, but I did once have a dentist called Mr Phang -nominative determinism at work!

When I did jury service we had a forensic specialist giving evidence called Doctor Dabs.

[P. G. Tipps]

I would certainly like there to be a limit to the number of ... Bruckner symphonies played per year.

Weren't you happy with 0 ... ?

That has been the Bruckner story on at least two occasions in very recent years.

As you and Suffolkcoastal say we could certainly do with a lot less Mahler, though ... and that ****** Brahms.

[Beef Oven!]

When I did jury service we had a forensic specialist giving evidence called Doctor Dabs.

I may have mentioned before, my junior school librarian was Miss Silence!

[Beef Oven!]

There's not enough Bruckner and I'm happy with the amount of Mahler. I am still struggling with Brahms, and probably always will.

[ahinton]

There's not enough Bruckner and I'm happy with the amount of Mahler. I am still struggling with Brahms, and probably always will.

Then I'm sorry for you. I do wonder, though, if some people's problems with Brahms stem largely from the experience of inadequate and less than representative performances of his music; Brahms might not be quite so bombproof in that sense as are some composers...

[Beef Oven!]

Then I'm sorry for you. I do wonder, though, if some people's problems with Brahms stem largely from the experience of inadequate and less than representative performances of his music; Brahms might not be quite so bombproof in that sense as are some composers...

Seems to me that the strength of Brahms' music lies in its craftsmanship - something that is completely lost on someone like me.

[Tevot]

Hello there,

Please don't get the impression that I dislike Mahler or Bruckner. Far from it. I just feel that they are overexposed - and that making way for other neglected pieces and works might be refreshing. Ditto - Beethoven and Shostakovich. How many times in recent years have orchestras come to the Proms offering for example Shosta 5, 7 and 10? Why not make way for relatively underperformed works like Shosta 13 and 14 or the Michelangelo sonnets? Or indeed works by other Russian / Eastern European composers? And as wonderful as Beethoven 9 is - does it have to be performed each year (with variable results)? Indeed as Mahler once remarked "Tradition ist Schlamperei" I'm sure there is scope and an appetite for experimentation at the Proms. Time for something fresh, something new or indeed the rehabilitation of works that have been neglected in recent years.

Two links here about Proms premieres might be of interest

http://www.theguardian.com/music/musicblog/2015/sep/11/10-of-the-best-bbc-proms-premieres-andrew-clements

http://www.classical-music.com/article/six-best-bbc-proms-world-premieres

Best Wishes,

Tevot

[P. G. Tipps]

Seems to me that the strength of Brahms' music lies in its craftsmanship - something that is completely lost on someone like me.

And far too clever by half for me ...

And yet some otherwise very clever folk are clearly baffled by the music of 'simpletons' like Bruckner.

All very baffling but I'd urge Tevot not to feel too sorry for me as bafflement has always been my default position in life.

[Roehre]

I couldn't agree more. Tevot

.....
Please don't get the impression that I dislike Mahler or Bruckner. Far from it. I just feel that they are overexposed - and that making way for other neglected pieces and works might be refreshing. Ditto - Beethoven and Shostakovich.

And within their overexposed outputs there are works which are more exposed than others indeed

Why not make way for relatively underperformed works like Shosta 13 and 14 or the Michelangelo sonnets? Or indeed works by other Russian / Eastern European composers? And as wonderful as Beethoven 9 is - does it have to be performed each year (with variable results)? Indeed as Mahler once remarked "Tradition ist Schlamperei" I'm sure there is scope and an appetite for experimentation at the Proms. Time for something fresh, something new or indeed the rehabilitation of works that have been neglected in recent years.

But looking at the main discussions on these boards [BaL e.g.] as well as having a look at what our contributors are listening to, I'm afraid there aren't too many really interested in music outside what generally is programmed during the Proms.

[Ferretfancy]

I couldn't agree more. Tevot



And within their overexposed outputs there are works which are more exposed than others indeed



But looking at the main discussions on these boards [BaL e.g.] as well as having a look at what our contributors are listening to, I'm afraid there aren't too many really interested in music outside what generally is programmed during the Proms.

Surely the point is that orchestras and soloists prefer to come to the Proms bringing music that they have already prepared,for example operas from Glyndebourne or later in the season works that have just been performed at the Edinburgh Festival. Economics have to be considered. I for one would welcome a chance to hear Rubbra symphonies at the RAH, but I know that this is unlikely simply because of the extra preparation involved. As it is, we have had some remarkable events in recent years, even including Havergal Brian's Gothic Symphony, which gave me the opportunity to confirm my guess that in common with quite a few other English composers he simply isn't worth the effort.

That's terrible prejudice isn't it? but after nearly seventy years of listening I've recognised the fact that unjustly neglected composers are usually unjustly neglected for a reason. When I first went to the Proms we were given performances of music by the likes of Holbrooke, whose music has since been resurrected by some of the smaller recording labels. I have tried, really I have, but he's just as uninspired to hear now as he was in 1950.

What I would like is the chance to hear new or unfamiliar works given a second performance during the season. Boulez did this for pieces by Webern with the BBC SO, which was very appropriate because the composer had been invited to conduct his music by Adrian Boult shortly after the orchestra was founded in the 1930s.
They tried harder then!

[Roehre]

Surely the point is that orchestras and soloists prefer to come to the Proms bringing music that they have already prepared,for example operas from Glyndebourne or later in the season works that have just been performed at the Edinburgh Festival. Economics have to be considered. I for one would welcome a chance to hear Rubbra symphonies at the RAH, but I know that this is unlikely simply because of the extra preparation involved. As it is, we have had some remarkable events in recent years, even including Havergal Brian's Gothic Symphony, which gave me the opportunity to confirm my guess that in common with quite a few other English composers he simply isn't worth the effort.

That's terrible prejudice isn't it? but after nearly seventy years of listening I've recognised the fact that unjustly neglected composers are usually unjustly neglected for a reason. When I first went to the Proms we were given performances of music by the likes of Holbrooke, whose music has since been resurrected by some of the smaller recording labels. I have tried, really I have, but he's just as uninspired to hear now as he was in 1950.

To some extent I do concur. But unjustly neglected composers are not necessarily unjustly neglected. The examples mentioned here are British (even English here). On the continent we hardly see Elgar or Vaughan Williams or any of the other in our opinion great British composers performed. Hence we must take into consideration that many continental (or for that matter: American, Russian) great composers remain under the radar on our isles.
We only have to recall suffolkcoastal's symphonic journey to illustrate what I mean here (Vermeulen, Diamond, Schuman, Hindemith, Hartmann, Henze, Pettersson, Koppel, Badings, Honegger, Schnittke, Weinberg, to mention a couple of 20C symphonic composers who are most definitely first rate, but so far hardly heard in Britain), and only quite recently names of Martinu, Nielsen, Szymanowski, Roussel and Magnard have emerged, following the Mahler fashion which also really started in the late 1970s.

Of course this extends to all types of (classical) music: as an alternative for DSCH's 15 quartets we could have a go at Holmboe's, e.g.

What I would like is the chance to hear new or unfamiliar works given a second performance during the season. Boulez did this for pieces by Webern with the BBC SO, which was very appropriate because the composer had been invited to conduct his music by Adrian Boult shortly after the orchestra was founded in the 1930s.
They tried harder then!

I'd love that approach; that approach was used already by Mengelberg at the helm of the Concertgebouw Orchestra introducing Mahler's works, e.g. a concert with Symphony 4 before the interval, and symphony 4 immediately following the interval.