Prom 16: Ibiza/Cobblers Prom (29.07.15)

[teamsaint]

To be fair only one in ten of them would say that

Perhaps they should just Do nothing,then.

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

Perhaps they should just Do nothing,then.

Anyone going to do the Communist moan pun?

[Beef Oven!]

On the beer front, i don't know what the story is over there, but here the beer choices of today are definitely more interesting than the 1970s. Then the market was dominated by a few large conglomerates all issuing carbonated soap. There has been an explosion of microbrewerys here since the millenium and the choices are much more varied and interesting.

There's so much choice these days. Some are outstanding like some of the Fullers beers, Timothy Taylor's, etc (and I adore Ruddles County), MrGG can fill in the gaps.

But you can't whack an ice cold Longlife, a period style (room temperature) Double Diamond or the king of them all, a pint of draft Ben Truman's!

[Beef Oven!]

I agree with a lot of Anna's #493 post above. I'm actually glad they tried this Ibiza style prom, but having heard an hour of it, I think the Proms with it, is almost less radical than one without.

Once something becomes 'safe', is made dad-friendly whatever, one feels the undertakers hovering nearby. This applies to any art form I think. Art at its most exciting, seems essentially a process of awakening, a broadening or refining of sth, to me.
The admittedly not very much pop/house music I hear (not quite sure of my terms) seems very conservative now, actually far less 'frightening to the horses' than many classical pieces. And once the status quo starts 'liking' sth, very often one senses the shutters coming down, and corporate money men with their anaesthetizing needles start arriving for the heart bypass operation, so that life after death will continue, but more in their image.

A classical only Proms season for example (particularly with much more 'new' music) would be much more dynamic than this season I think. I prefer the idea of a Proms with music from different genres, but this Ibiza Prom seemed almost Butlins-esque. Personally I'd have been more interested if something with more of a sneer on its face had turned up, or something more genuinely new (I know this was celebrating 20 years of Ibiza, but that seemed a slightly tired formula for something supposedly cage-rattling), I'm sure there are a lot of fantastic minds at work in the electronic scene who could bring a great deal of excitement and fresh air to the Proms. Such concerts would I imagine, be more likely to be a portal from 'pop' to 'art music', which I'd understood to be one of the putative aims.

But yes (in case my point got lost in that waffle) I think an exciting Proms is an evolving one (i.e not resting on its laurels), but I'm not sure this particular concert burned as brightly in that way, as it might have.

(p.s. I am 507 and always hated Double Diamond)

I'm not sure why there is an expectation that music like Ibiza chill-out or anything else that's not the standard fare should be 'not safe', 'edgy' or 'scary to dads'. Ibiza music has always been very 'safe' and 'ear-friendly'. It's quite Butlins-esque. The music didn't scare the horses - the idea of something that the horses didn't understand/like/was different frightened them.

And why should its inclusion in a Prom come with an expectation of it making things 'radical', less radical, or whatever?

I'm very pleased that this Prom went ahead, and I would like more concerts like it, with or without 'a sneer on its face' (I'm easy about that sort of thing in music).

[EdgeleyRob]

Ibiza is the Spanish town where British trash go to binge drink.

Eh ???

Ibiza is a lovely place .
Spent many a family holiday there when our kids were younger.
The whole island is not full of lager louts.
Plenty of nice quiet beaches,lovely walks and lots of history.

http://www.ibiza.travel/en/monumentos.php

[Daniel]

I'm not sure why there is an expectation that music like Ibiza chill-out or anything else that's not the standard fare should be 'not safe', 'edgy' or 'scary to dads'.

It's not an expectation, just a hope. Though not knowing much about it, I didn't know until you mentioned it, that all Ibiza type music is Butlins-esque, safe or whatever. If I had, I don't suppose I'd have had the same hopes.

And why should its inclusion in a Prom come with an expectation of it making things 'radical', less radical, or whatever?

Why shouldn't it?

My answer though to your question is the same, it was a hope, not an expectation.

I'm very pleased that this Prom went ahead, and I would like more concerts like it, with or without 'a sneer on its face' (I'm easy about that sort of thing in music).

I'm pleased it happened too, and in principle I'd like more concerts like it, but I guess I hope I'd find it more exciting than this one.

[EdgeleyRob]

I'm not sure why there is an expectation that music like Ibiza chill-out or anything else that's not the standard fare should be 'not safe', 'edgy' or 'scary to dads'. Ibiza music has always been very 'safe' and 'ear-friendly'. It's quite Butlins-esque. The music didn't scare the horses - the idea of something that the horses didn't understand/like/was different frightened them.

And why should its inclusion in a Prom come with an expectation of it making things 'radical', less radical, or whatever?

I'm very pleased that this Prom went ahead, and I would like more concerts like it, with or without 'a sneer on its face' (I'm easy about that sort of thing in music).

I think it was an opportunity missed.
If we are to have this at the Proms let's have the real deal,which is super music IMO, no need for an orchestra to dress it up.

[Anna]

I think it was an opportunity missed.
If we are to have this at the Proms let's have the real deal,which is super music IMO, no need for an orchestra to dress it up.

If you want the real deal (and if Daniel wants more excitement) then you should have tuned in to the 4 hours R1 had this evening streamed direct from Ibiza! But you can't have a Prom without a full orchestra otherwise it wouldn't be a proper Prom ......

Talking of which, the Rap & Grime Prom coming up on August 12th has a specially composed Grime Symphony with Krept and Konan (amongst others) backed by the same orchestra as the Ibiza Prom. I should think that'll also turn out to be a rather sanitised and limp affair

[Beef Oven!]

I think it was an opportunity missed.
If we are to have this at the Proms let's have the real deal,which is super music IMO, no need for an orchestra to dress it up.

It needs to be seen for what it was, not what could've been. Why all the carping?

Let's see if future seasons give us more and better.

[Beef Oven!]

It's not an expectation, just a hope.

Hardly any difference in the context.

Why shouldn't it?

Because there's nothing radical about it.

I'm pleased it happened too, and in principle I'd like more concerts like it, but I guess I hope I'd find it more exciting than this one.

I also find some Proms better than others.

[EdgeleyRob]

It needs to be seen for what it was, not what could've been. Why all the carping?

Let's see if future seasons give us more and better.

Why not programme Ibiza anthems as they are meant to be heard,thassorl.

It's like a concerto for prepared piano played on a normal piano,or Brahms 2nd serenade with with the addition of violins, trumpets, trombones, and percussion,in order to make them more prommable.

[MrGongGong]

Why not programme Ibiza anthems as they are meant to be heard,thassorl.

It's like a concerto for prepared piano played on a normal piano,or Brahms 2nd serenade with with the addition of violins, trumpets, trombones, and percussion,in order to make them more prommable.

Aaaah a discussion about MUSIC

What do you feel about this?

[Beef Oven!]

Why not programme Ibiza anthems as they are meant to be heard,thassorl.

It's like a concerto for prepared piano played on a normal piano,or Brahms 2nd serenade with with the addition of violins, trumpets, trombones, and percussion,in order to make them more prommable.

Indeed, I'd support a HIPP Ibiza Prom.

[EdgeleyRob]

Aaaah a discussion about MUSIC

What do you feel about this?

BBM might like it.

[Daniel]

Because there's nothing radical about it.

Yes, I guess I shoehorned the 'radical' thing in a bit ... I suppose because of a vague feeling that the anti-Ibiza Prom people on this thread, were being seen as 'squares' and frightened of change. And actually I thought their's could be seen as the 'unsquare' or bolder stance, in the light of what I heard of the concert.
Anyway I'll repeat I was glad a Prom like this was happening, but this one (regardless of any of my misdirected radical considerations) didn't excite me.

Also perhaps there are one or two creators on the Ibiza scene who think differently about its radical potential? (Not that I know, I might try out Anna's R1 suggestion). Genres often evolve in the hands of imaginative people. There's room for both orthodox and evolved versions of a genre to sit side by side, I think.

p.s

Hardly any difference in the context [between my hope and expectation about the gig]

This seems a bit fag-end, but I'd distinguish thus: I hoped the gig would be a bit more adventurous, but had no expectations it would be.

p.p.s
I have a vague memory of somebody on this thread saying 'I googled "unusual uses for Vicks"', for which many thanks, it really made me laugh. It makes you wonder if the people at Google ever get the time to lower their eyebrows.