"The right to bare arms" and the Elder"states"man.

[Richard Tarleton]

#15
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Sorry, missed that!

[kea]

What a perfectly ridiculous thing to object to. (And somewhat misogynistic, but I suppose I must expect that around here...) No one goes to concerts for the musicians' outfits.

(I personally wouldn't care if the members of the orchestra wore casual clothes—as they often do at rehearsals—or dressing-gowns, or enormous fur coats, or chain mail, or nothing whatsoever. So long as it doesn't impede them from playing their instruments.)

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

What a perfectly ridiculous thing to object to. (And somewhat misogynistic, but I suppose I must expect that around here...) No one goes to concerts for the musicians' outfits.

(I personally wouldn't care if the members of the orchestra wore casual clothes—as they often do at rehearsals—or dressing-gowns, or enormous fur coats, or chain mail, or nothing whatsoever. So long as it doesn't impede them from playing their instruments.)

[Eine Alpensinfonie]

(I personally wouldn't care if the members of the orchestra wore casual clothes—as they often do at rehearsals—or dressing-gowns, or enormous fur coats, or chain mail, or nothing whatsoever. So long as it doesn't impede them from playing their instruments.)

I used to think that, but then Nigel Kennedy came along. . .

[Serial_Apologist]

I just get my head down and listen - even with jazz: for me that's what music's for. I don't go to ballet or opera. The only time I had to get up and look was a Proms performance of Ives 4's second movement.

[MrGongGong]

Some people really enjoy telling women what to wear
too much
too little

Some performances require costumes
though the ones that orchestras often wear don't seem to work well IMV

[doversoul1]

What a perfectly ridiculous thing to object to. (And somewhat misogynistic, but I suppose I must expect that around here...) No one goes to concerts for the musicians' outfits.

(I personally wouldn't care if the members of the orchestra wore casual clothes—as they often do at rehearsals—or dressing-gowns, or enormous fur coats, or chain mail, or nothing whatsoever. So long as it doesn't impede them from playing their instruments.)

I know it makes you feel good to say all that but the point of this thread is not about what performers should/shouldn’t wear but it is about what women should/shouldn’t wear if they want to play in an orchestra. Or that's what Hornspieler who started the thread seems to be saying.

[french frank]

Interesting how often these differences of opinion boil down to those 'who care'/those 'who don't care'.

"Well, it doesn't bother me if … X"/"It bothers me (sometimes greatly) if … X".

Even when there would seem to be a general principle that might in many cases be acceptable to both sides, extraordinarily, it seldom is acceptable to both.

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

Yeah - universal language, innit? Brings people together - so they can reach each other with their handbags/umbrellas etc etc.

[Lat-Literal]

Interesting how often these differences of opinion boil down to those 'who care'/those 'who don't care'.

"Well, it doesn't bother me if … X"/"It bothers me (sometimes greatly) if … X".

Even when there would seem to be a general principle that might in many cases be acceptable to both sides, extraordinarily, it seldom is acceptable to both.

It could be tackled in another way. The principle could be based on who is saying whatever is being said. Beecham - he was a character and his contribution to music was such he could have said anything as far as I am concerned. It's trivial compared with his brilliance. Cameron to Eagle - "Calm Down Dear" - that just confirms for me everything about him.

[greenilex]

Musicians in church are a different subset, I suppose?

[Hornspieler]

Musicians in church are a different subset, I suppose?

In my time, it was normal not to wear Evening Dress in a Cathedral or Church. (In fact, in Winchester Cathedral, the audience was treated more as a congregation and had almost to sit through high mass before and after the performance.
Audience applause was unthinkable.

It was deemed unchristian to charge people to enter the hallowed ground, but you had to pay to get out!

Thankfully, those days are behind us.

I seem to have started an argument here, but the reaction (and the number of replies) is certainly more than I had expected.

BTW: It seems strange that no comment has been made about the BSO's performance.

One of the most difficult symphonies in the repertoire. Did nobody listen in?

HS

NB I have a new email address if you wish to make personal contact.

It is horn.maester@gmail.com

[Serial_Apologist]

Musicians in church are a different subset, I suppose?

Yes - they're all surplice to requirements.

[Stanfordian]

What a perfectly ridiculous thing to object to. (And somewhat misogynistic, but I suppose I must expect that around here...) No one goes to concerts for the musicians' outfits.

(I personally wouldn't care if the members of the orchestra wore casual clothes—as they often do at rehearsals—or dressing-gowns, or enormous fur coats, or chain mail, or nothing whatsoever. So long as it doesn't impede them from playing their instruments.)

Hiya Kia,


I do appreciate your viewpoint. I was trying to explain that it makes little sense to me that one group in the same orchestra is wearing the same clothes whilst the other group wear everything different. I am generally one of those that enjoy in the classical music world the custom and practice of orchestral players or soloists wearing smart dress even formal wear. Of course it doesn’t effect the music but it’s all part of the overall presentation, dressing up; to feel good, looking one's best, prepared for the special show. I remember Lang Lang in recital wearing a modern styled dinner suit and he looked smart and stylish and ready for the event, for the show. I also remember a well known British pianist who wearing a tatty, ill-fitting, everyday outfit that gave the impression that they have just finished cleaning the kitchen floor. Of course appearances do matter to some people and clearly not to others.

[french frank]

It could be tackled in another way. The principle could be based on who is saying whatever is being said.

I would have said (for instance in this case) the principle would be that if those who say, "I personally wouldn't care if the members of the orchestra wore casual clothes—as they often do at rehearsals—or dressing-gowns, or enormous fur coats, or chain mail, or nothing whatsoever" were to give in to those who advocated some sort of comfortable uniformity for all players, everyone would be happy.

But would they be? I doubt it very much: people would find a dozen reasons for disagreeing