Proms audience behaviour

[french frank]

Maybe a huge WHOOOOOOP in between notes at 11:30 Feldman in St Pauls Hall isn't

Only 'maybe'? And why only 'enthusiasm and clapping' at the Proms, not a huge WHOOOP between the movements of a Mahler symphony?

[Lento]

I would think that the key 2 words are the last two
Responding with enthusiasm and clapping at The Proms would seem to be highly appropriate IMV
Maybe a huge WHOOOOOOP in between notes at 11:30 Feldman in St Pauls Hall isn't

Sure. I guess what matters to many people is the idea of fostering an appropriate atmosphere for audience and players alike, and showing a degree of respect for the same, and, dare I say it, towards the (often long since deceased) composer. A little applause between the movements of a Haydn symphony seems OK to me, if that's what people want to do. In a tragic work like Mahler 6 it would seem better all round if people tried to keep quiet until a few seconds after the final notes.

[MrGongGong]

Only 'maybe'? And why only 'enthusiasm and clapping' at the Proms, not a huge WHOOOP between the movements of a Mahler symphony?

Depends on which one
and where

Context innit

[Bryn]

... Maybe a huge WHOOOOOOP in between notes at 11:30 Feldman in St Pauls Hall isn't

I recall a big brash Bronx audience member who snored his way through much of a performance of an extended Feldman work. Mortified we were.

[Hilaryjane]

Well, god forbid that we should be enthusiastic.

As has been pointed out in past airings of this subject, in the past it was perfectly acceptable - indeed, expected - for people to applaud between movements in symphonies, oratorios, etc. Then it became acceptable, or expected, to wait until the end of the work. Now there is a tendency to return to the former practice. What's the problem?

The problem is twofold. Firstly, the applause between movements at the Proms is not that of audiences being enthusiastic. If that were the case, the applause would be prolonged and would consist of the whole audience. Instead, one person politely applauds (presumably because they think the piece of the music they have been listening to is finished), followed by a smattering of others in the audience, until they realise that the music is not over. Secondly, if it were the case that it is now acceptable to applaud between movements, why does this never (or almost never) happen in other concert halls. I don't recall listening to Mahler 6 in say, the RFH or the Barbican, where there has been applause after the first movement. It only seems to happen at the Proms.

[jean]

It does happen in other halls - though never in my experience at every concert, and not only at concerts of more 'popular' repertoire. It's impossible to predict and, as you say, it's never a spontaneous outburst, or related to the degree of enthusiasm displayed at the end of the concert.

This year at the RLPO season preview, we had the whole orchestra there, playing enticing bits of the coming season's repertoire. Before they played a single movement from a Tchaikovsky symphony, Petrenko told us that we were allowed to clap when it was over. Afterwards, he turned to the audience and said solemnly 'But please don't do it when we perform the whole symphony!'

[jean]

. . . combined with a perfume and/or after-shave monitor, please! Some of the scents can be just too much - at least for my oversensitive nose.

I've got a phial of oil of frankincense that I save for performances of Renaissance masses.

[Nick Armstrong]

The Annual Prom Clap Trap!

A happy absence of Clap Trap at the Tonhalle prom last night. Not a single applaud between movements... OK, it was helped because Dvorak had the sense to run the first two movements of his concerto together, and Beethoven the last three movements of the Pastoral. That left 3 inter-movement gaps which no-one filled with a clap or a 'yaroo'...

There was a positive barrage of coughing in the two gaps in the Beethoven though. The young French relative I was taking to his first concert evinced astonishment and said (I translate freely): "Why the hell is everyone coughing? Is it some sort of fashion at classical concerts? If they're ill, why don't they just stay at home?!"

I couldn't argue with any of that

[Bryn]

The cry was a strange one, to be sure. Could this have been the protest so eagerly awaited?

As to "tragic", for me that certainly describes the performance, though not in the way Mahler might have intended, I think.

[Oldcrofter]

I do hope that Sarah Connolly won't have to face a similar nightmare at the RAH this evening (Prom 7)

http://www.theartsdesk.com/opera/nightmare-aix-sarah-connolly-shocking-first-night

[french frank]

The problem is twofold. Firstly, the applause between movements at the Proms is not that of audiences being enthusiastic. If that were the case, the applause would be prolonged and would consist of the whole audience. Instead, one person politely applauds (presumably because they think the piece of the music they have been listening to is finished), followed by a smattering of others in the audience, until they realise that the music is not over.

Logically, so that the clappers shouldn't feel awkward, everyone should oblige by joining in encouragingly, smiling and nodding enthusiastically at everyone around them to demonstrate their pleasure. They could probably make it last at least 10 minutes if they tried really hard.

[Sounds a bit like something thought up by Gerard Hoffnung: Advice for the First Time Prommer]

[Sir Velo]

Well, god forbid that we should be enthusiastic.

As has been pointed out in past airings of this subject, in the past it was perfectly acceptable - indeed, expected - for people to applaud between movements in symphonies, oratorios, etc. Then it became acceptable, or expected, to wait until the end of the work. Now there is a tendency to return to the former practice. What's the problem?

That's because the way in which music is appreciated has changed. In the 18th century music was primarily a diversion or divertissement (very little was profound, and even where it was, composers were so grateful to have their music performed they tolerated the lack of attention paid to most of their works in performance). Through Romanticism and the growth of the symphony, music of greater emotional weight and profundity led to a recognition that greater attention should be paid to the music. This of course led to a change in (acceptable) audience behaviour.

[jayne lee wilson]

I'd rather sit next to someone with a natural smell than wearing a liberal application of the dreadful perfumes sold by fasion houses (or fading footballers etc).

The belief that the smell of a deodorant is better than a natural body smell is yet another Americanisation of European culture.

Je Recommande Clarins Eau Dynamisante*... mild, fresh, made from plants... Eau wow! Etc...

*"For women and men too!"

[mangerton]

[Sounds a bit like something thought up by Gerard Hoffnung: Advice for the First Time Prommer]

Quite. Well up there with his "All London brothels display a blue lamp".

[MrGongGong]

The problem is twofold. Firstly, the applause between movements at the Proms is not that of audiences being enthusiastic.

How on earth do you know that ?
I've met many people in my 50 years who respond to music in more ways that I could ever have imagined

Great edit Bryn

I've just arrived at a rather posh Swiss music festival
and I'm expecting there to be all sorts of clapping between movements and enthusiastic yodelling at every well executed cadence