Prom 26 - 1.08.13: Henze, Stravinsky & Tippett

[pilamenon]

Thus, it was very clever and apt of Peter Serkin to play an encore that was a song (from Gershwin's songbook?)

The announcer said it was a piece by Takemitsu. Whoever it was, it was lovely.

I agree with all the positive comments about this concert - a super programme that would never get a big audience (glossed over by Radio 3, who commented on how many people were there - why they are so afraid to speak the truth?). Agree with edashtav that the Tippett symphony was the least impressive piece of the evening, but I will try to give it another listen, as I had been looking forward to it. I think I missed the sense of structure that had been so apparent in the Henze work and Stravinsky concerto. Incidentally, despite the acres of space the announcer had to fill between the final two works (including a painful and unenlightening conversation backstage with two members of the orchestra), he still didn't manage to explain what the structure of the Tippett work was - this used to be standard practice.

[edashtav]

The announcer said it was a piece by Takemitsu. Whoever it was, it was lovely.

Thanks for the "heads up" re Takemitsu - I couldn't put my finger on it, it was more ethereal, more "cool" than I'd expect from Gershwin. On a hot night, full of gritty music, it was beautiful and refreshing.

[EnemyoftheStoat]

The announcer said it was a piece by Takemitsu. Whoever it was, it was lovely.

I agree with all the positive comments about this concert - a super programme that would never get a big audience (glossed over by Radio 3, who commented on how many people were there - why they are so afraid to speak the truth?). Agree with edashtav that the Tippett symphony was the least impressive piece of the evening, but I will try to give it another listen, as I had been looking forward to it. I think I missed the sense of structure that had been so apparent in the Henze work and Stravinsky concerto. Incidentally, despite the acres of space the announcer had to fill between the final two works (including a painful and unenlightening conversation backstage with two members of the orchestra), he still didn't manage to explain what the structure of the Tippett work was - this used to be standard practice.

It's somewhat ironic that the audience for this one maybe one-third filled the RAH (a demanding program like this was never going to do otherwise) but the numbers would have represented a near sell-out at the Barbican Hall. However, I'd bet my socks that if it had been a Barbican (winter season) concert that venue would in fact have been half full at best - something is very wrong with the marketing of those gigs and an admission of that (rather than just "oh, we're a broadcasting orchestra") would be a refreshing first step in the right direction.

A super programme indeed - Olly's Proms - indeed any Olly concerts - are always first on my list but the calendar doesn't always permit.

[amateur51]

Mention has been made of Olly's not looking well. Does anyone know anything definite?

All good wishes to him, whatever.

[Nick Armstrong]

Mention has been made of Olly's not looking well. Does anyone know anything definite?

He's looking remarkably trim if the R3 website is to be believed*

Quite the makeover...







*which it isn't.

[edashtav]

He's looking remarkably trim if the R3 website is to be believed*

Quite the makeover...







*which it isn't.

is the key
> SHOW MORE, Caliban ?

I swear there was lots more to show!

[Flay]

Mention has been made of Olly's not looking well. Does anyone know anything definite?

All good wishes to him, whatever.

Unfortunately he has put on a great deal of weight (morbidly so), which was a shock. He struggled to walk to the podium, and was seated throughout. For whatever reason, it was sad to see.

All credit to him for carrying on

[ahinton]

Unfortunately he has put on a great deal of weight (morbidly so), which was a shock. He struggled to walk to the podium, and was seated throughout. For whatever reason, it was sad to see.

All credit to him for carrying on

This has happened with him before, sadly; I've worried about him and how he keeps going for quite some time now, having known him for more years than I can remember. I'll drop him a line. I though that his Tippett performance was splendid, by the way.

[edashtav]

This has happened with him before, sadly; I've worried about him and how he keeps going for quite some time now, having known him for more years than I can remember. I'll drop him a line. I though that his Tippett performance was splendid, by the way.

Thank You.

[jayne lee wilson]

Edashtav's implication - that the only thing stopping you from hearing Tippett's 2nd as an undoubted, highly original masterpiece is unfamiliarity - is right of course. If you wish the presenter had described the structure, what are you looking for? The structures of the individual movements couldn't be clearer - an energetic sonata-allegro, its temperamental opposite in a static song-form slow movement, a classical scherzo of playful abandon (but which flirts with chaos, abandon's shadow) and a Fantasia -Finale containing several forms in one, including variations and a classic in-my-end-is-my-beginning conclusion.

The piece exhibits melodic and harmonic inspiration on a high and memorable level, but if we seek to seek to fix its moods or meanings in a verbal canvas we may find that the sequence of movements presented, where episode and evocation is at least as important as "symphonic argument" defeats us. This is partly down to our classically-formed expectation of symphonic "teleology": we listen to Shostakovich 10 and we expect, and follow, a narrative - to a fulfilling conclusion.
Such a work as Tippett's 2nd is rather a juxtaposition of sound-images, a placing side by side of moods and atmospheres. It follows the logic of imagination rather than of architectural, argumentative concepts. You can only perceive its "unity" through your familiarity, your absorption into its moods, and emotions. (But you can also see it as Tippett's own take on the neoclassical symphony, albeit one which includes neo-baroque and other styles in its generous allusiveness).

It's a huge problem in classical programming, that The New too often remains just that - squeezed in among these we have loved, hardly a second chance to find a place in our memories and hearts. The love for our classical "mainstream" is deep and true - but we've yet to find a way of admitting the new and the not-so-new into that "familiarity", a perception which would allow it to dwell inside us, and allow us to lose our fear of it.

[edashtav]

Edashtav's implication - that the only thing stopping you from hearing Tippett's 2nd as an undoubted, highly original masterpiece is unfamiliarity - is right of course. If you wish the presenter had described the structure, what are you looking for? The structures of the individual movements couldn't be clearer - an energetic sonata-allegro, its temperamental opposite in a static song-form slow movement, a classical scherzo of playful abandon (but which flirts with chaos, abandon's shadow) and a Fantasia -Finale containing several forms in one, including variations and a classic in-my-end-is-my-beginning conclusion.

The piece exhibits melodic and harmonic inspiration on a high and memorable level, but if we seek to seek to fix its moods or meanings in a verbal canvas we may find that the sequence of movements presented, where episode and evocation is at least as important as "symphonic argument" defeats us. This is partly down to our classically-formed expectation of symphonic "teleology": we listen to Shostakovich 10 and we expect, and follow, a narrative - to a fulfilling conclusion.
Such a work as Tippett's 2nd is rather a juxtaposition of sound-images, a placing side by side of moods and atmospheres. It follows the logic of imagination rather than of architectural, argumentative concepts. You can only perceive its "unity" through your familiarity, your absorption into its moods, and emotions.

It's a huge problem in classical programming, that The New too often remains just that - squeezed in among these we have loved, hardly a second chance to find a place in our memories and hearts. The love for our classical "mainstream" is deep and true - but we've yet to find a way of admitting the new and the not-so-new into that "familiarity", a perception which would allow it to dwell inside us, and allow us to lose our fear of it.

CONCORD!

[pilamenon]

Thanks jayne for the information about the structure. I will try to find time to listen again, and concentrate better. I just wasn't blown away by the sound it was making first time. And I still think presenters should outline the structure - it all helps, especially for listeners less familiar with a work.

[bluestateprommer]

Unfortunately he has put on a great deal of weight (morbidly so), which was a shock. He struggled to walk to the podium, and was seated throughout. For whatever reason, it was sad to see.

All credit to him for carrying on

OK has always been a big fellow, but is he even more so than before? I've seen him once in concert, and he was a big lug then. That slightly queasy concern over his health aside, this struck me somehow as one of the least recondite of the "Olly Proms", or maybe my ideas of esoteric programming aren't most people's ;) . I'd not heard the Henze Barcarola before, but what struck me was what seemed like a passage that sounded like a more dissonant near rip-off of Britten's Sinfonia da Requiem (perhaps another reason for its inclusion in the Britten centenary year, besides being a tribute to Henze). While I'm hardly a fan of neo-classical period Stravinsky, Peter Serkin, OK and the winds of the BBC SO did a very fine job in the Concerto for Piano and Winds. All forces involved were likewise terrific in the much "harder to get to" Movements, and the Takemitsu encore was a nice touch there from PS. Hard to think that it's taken this long to get him to The Proms, at age 66.

Regarding the Tippett Symphony No. 2, it's taken me a while, or perhaps just getting older, to realize what disconcerts me about the work, namely the very end, where the thuddiness of the timpani feels like death to me, where the pulse just kind of dies at the end, rather like the end of his Symphony No. 1, in a quieter sense. This is nothing about OK's performance with the orchestra, of course, which was quite good. But for that kind of emotion reason about the end, I can go without listening to the work for a while now. In any event, not that Knussen is reading any of these comments, but here's hoping that he watches his diet, drops some weight, and takes care of himself. We want him around for a good while to write more music.

[Roehre]

No one seems to recall that Tippett's 2nd and 4th symphonies (conducted by himself) featured on a BBC Music Magazine CD as far back as 1995 - a CD now available on NMC.
Time enough to familiarize oneself with it, methinks.