Prom 19 (28.7.12): Gudmunsen-Holmgreen, Shostakovich, Langgaard & Tchaikovsky

[Serial_Apologist]

Depends which tradition is under discussion. The composer clearly intended the title to provoke and reject associations with the post-19th Century traditions (Teutonic and Nationalist) of "The Symphony" (which is why Simpson banned them from his Penguin "Republic" of real Symphonies).

... and based on tonal (ie diatonic) relationships and development - which is why, apart from other objections I have to this definition (which would exclude eg Henze's 7th) Simpson was wrong, as far as memory serves me, to exclude Schoenberg's two chamber symphonies.

Following a work like Gabrielli's Sonate pian' e forte, however, the connection is clearly audible.

Agreed. And I suspect Stravinsky would have known Satie's "Socrate", whose spirit is similar, and subtitle, I believe, "drame symphonique")

[french frank]

My first post.

'Evening, Phileas. Many happy returns, I hope

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

... and based on tonal (ie diatonic) relationships and development - which is why, apart from other objections I have to this definition (which would exclude eg Henze's 7th) Simpson was wrong, as far as memory serves me, to exclude Schoenberg's two chamber symphonies.

Your memory serves you well: "they're chamber works" so don't count.

When Simpson was composing, or describing Music he admired, he was superb. Otherwise, he could be such an ass!

[3rd Viennese School]

Simpson rejected Stravinsky's symphonies ( in C, in 3 mvts etc.) because he considered them ballet works! "The Rythmn changes and the whole orchestra jogs with it.."

Anyway, I heard the Langgaard (I had to, didnt I!) This symphony no.11 wasnt a small symphony in the Webern sense or even in the Mozart early symphony sense of the word.

It was a fanfare being played over and over again in different keys!

Heard it on my personal radio in Dartford Wetherspoons. (Cider festival) I nearly fell off my bar stool! I thought "This boy is shot away!!"

Also heard Holmgreen Incanti which was 3 times as long, more dark and serious. Including the drums actually playing different notes!


I've got to hear these on the repeat! Roll on Friday 2pm!

3VS

[Phileas]

The Langgaard was tedious.

I listened to it briefly again last night, just to confirm my initial impression.

[gradus]

I thought this the finest, most deeply felt live performance of the Pathetique I've ever heard in 50 years of listening.

[edashtav]

Simpson rejected Stravinsky's symphonies ( in C, in 3 mvts etc.) because he considered them ballet works! "The Rythmn changes and the whole orchestra jogs with it.."

Anyway, I heard the Langgaard (I had to, didnt I!) This symphony no.11 wasnt a small symphony in the Webern sense or even in the Mozart early symphony sense of the word.

It was a fanfare being played over and over again in different keys!


I've got to hear these on the repeat! Roll on Friday 2pm!

3VS

I, too, listened to the repeat this afternoon, 3VS. I agree with you that Langgard's 11th had no symphonic form.

Langgaard was a regressive composer with nothing to say. Perhaps his symphonic cycle was a Sisyphean journey with the composer constantly starting afresh on a new symphonic journey that led nowhere except, perhaps, to a need to start all over again. Thank goodness effort no 11 left Langgaard exhausted through pointless repetition so soon after its beginning. Personally, I found the piece devoid of virtue and replete with inanities.

Gudmunsen-Holmgreen Incontri is described as "jungle baroque" and the related to its antecedents in much the same crazy fashion as parts of Koechlin’s Les Bandar-log mimic dodecaphony. It was fun and played with great spirit. Perhaps the players had been hitting the Jungle Juice.

I respect Daniel Muller-Schott’s understated virtuosity. His gifts never obstruct the music that he’s playing but are used to illuminate the score. So, it was in his performance of the Shostakovitch First Concerto: witty, sardonic, bitter and wistful measures were fused into an engrossing canvas. This was a real journey, perhaps it deserved the title Symphony-Concerto more that Prokofiev’s effort which Daniel plays so well.

[heliocentric]

Personally, I found the piece devoid of virtue and replete with inanities.

Faint praise indeed!

It certainly wasn't up to much compared with his Sfærernes musik, but as yet I haven't come across anything else in his output that is. Would I be right in thinking that Bryn knows more about Langgaard than most contributors here? Maybe he has some recommendations.

[Bryn]

Faint praise indeed!

It certainly wasn't up to much compared with his Sfærernes musik, but as yet I haven't come across anything else in his output that is. Would I be right in thinking that Bryn knows more about Langgaard than most contributors here? Maybe he has some recommendations.

Sorry to potentially disappoint but though I invested in the complete symphonies set and the DVD of Antichrist, etc., I have yet to listen to most of the symphonies and found Antichrist a rather bizarre experience, though one well worth having.

[Bryn]

Anyone wanting to check out more Langgaard might like to tune in to, or catch later on the iPlayer, a couple of pieces for mezzo-soprano and string quartet (TtN tonight).