Prom 12 (23.7.12): Beethoven Cycle – Symphonies Nos. 5 & 6

[subcontrabass]

Messages 44 to 56.

Please tell me what all this technical jargon has to do with Beethoven's 5th and 6th symphonies.

Isn't there a place on Platform 3 for this?

There is a separate "Techie Board" precisely for such things.

[Flay]

But it was a useful aside. Thank you Jayne

[amateur51]

Messages 44 to 56.

Please tell me what all this technical jargon has to do with Beethoven's 5th and 6th symphonies.

Isn't there a place on Platform 3 for this?

Wildly off-post!

HS

Oh dear, Colonel Hathi's displeased ....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PrQQZuLru9s

[jayne lee wilson]

But it was a useful aside. Thank you Jayne

You're welcome...
"Spread a little happiness..."

[Ariosto]

East West Divan orchestra and DB


I've listened to a couple of movements of LvB No 6 on TV tonight and I suppose it was OK, but I'm beginning to agree with Hornspieler about those wind players moving about so much, and in the end the overall performance is not so convincing. And you can have too much of ANY conductor! I've seen too many face on like that over the years, and it gets a bit tedious.

I'm kind of musically burnt out at the moment, and I think I should sign off from music for a few days, maybe weeks or months, who knows.

See you all at the undertakers ...

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

See you all at the undertakers ...

Make it the Pub, Ari: rather a cask than a casket!

[jayne lee wilson]

Cheer up Ariosto... a walk in the country might help, or just a change of rep...

Exhausted after some busy days I just tuned in for Part One tonight, not feeling up to it really - the Hugh Wood Piano Concerto was a great refreshment! Maybe you should plunge into Kaija Saariaho's Orchestral Works, or perhaps try flying microlites...

All too easily afflicted by gloom, I find any change of routine is at least a perspective on a busy, stressful or weary life...
But c'est la vie... bonne voyage on the worldly journey.

[cloughie]

East West Divan orchestra and DB


I've listened to a couple of movements of LvB No 6 on TV tonight and I suppose it was OK, but I'm beginning to agree with Hornspieler about those wind players moving about so much, and in the end the overall performance is not so convincing.

My verdict too -as a performance it is getting there, but not quite! The Boulez thing with the flute - sorry it got my teeth on edge - didn't like it at all. Going back to try the Fifth!

[Alf-Prufrock]

Goodness me... this is the Radio 3 live stream of Proms and all other programming, available online from their homepage. The logo (HD with a little "s" inside the D) appears towards the top right corner of the player panel. "HDs" (high definition sound) is their name for it, hardly accurate technically but in fact the highest quality classical webstream available in Europe (it has been used by Berlin DCH, still is by Medici i think...), AAC at 320kbps. It's about equal to FM in definition, spatial and timbral accuracy etc., but has a far superior dynamic range owing to the "Optimod" Processor's dynamic compression applied to FM. It's been running since 2010. Best way of getting it is through iTunes where the stream is totally stable. (iTunes>Radio>Classical>Radio 3 High)...

Sorry, thought everyone knew...

Many thanks for your reply, Jayne - all is now clear. I did also think (belatedly) of high definition but rejected it as a video and TV term. I had not realised the BBC used it for their superior audio stream. I shall have to investigate it, but really I think what is gained in making it HD is lost by hearing it on computer speakers! My hi-fi is unfortunately not even on the same storey as my computer and wi-fi has proved useless so far. So I cannot link the BBC stream to my hi-fi - yet!

My very best wishes to you - I really appreciate your contributions to this board and think them among the very best. I always look forward to reading your contributions. Alf.

[Hornspieler]

East West Divan orchestra and DB


.... I'm beginning to agree with Hornspieler about those wind players moving about so much, and in the end the overall performance is not so convincing. See you all at the undertakers ...

Have you seen your doctor about this?

Hornspieler

[Northender]

We shall watch the Choral Symphony on BBC4 at 7.30. Assuming Maestro Barenboim adopts reasonable tempi, we shall then tune to BBC2 to watch a documentary about Snowdonia. We shall save 'Richard II' until Sunday (out visiting friends - fellow Olympic Refuseniks - tomorrow).

[Pabmusic]

... with nothing added to the normal classical orchestra apart from two trombones. Only 2 timps, and no thunder machine, wind machine or organ. Am I decrying a thunderstorm that does include these extras? Not at all. It's just that Beethoven does it better.

Don't forget the Piccolo...Sheer genius of orchestration: a 1780s-like orchestra (no Trumpets or Timps) that suddenly becomes the orchestra Beethoven used in the Fifth Symphony, just for these three explosive minutes.

Unfortunately, I missed the concert, and I've only just read through this thread, so forgive me if this was covered by the oh-so-well-qualified presenter. The orchestration is worth considering. These were the very first two symphonies to include either trombones or a piccolo (I've known that for too many years, but I've never heard that anything else can claim credit). They were both given their first performances in the same concert, with the Pastoral played first (like the other night), so the first time anyone ever heard a piccolo in a symphony was five bars after E in the Storm of the Pastoral; the first time anyone ever heard trombones in a symphony was four bars after F. This makes these very great moments, and everything should be done to make these entries tell. Beethoven doesn't help; the piccolo parts lie a bit low, particularly in No. 5 (which is why it's quite difficult to make the piccolo tell in the finale). But it can work really well in the Pastoral. I've heard at least two performances of No. 5 in which the conductors had the piccolo play an octave higher for some passages, but it just doesn't sound right. The Fifth also uses a contrabassoon - again, for the first time in a symphony.

[Hornspieler]

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/culture/music/proms/9423881/Proms-2012-West-Eastern-Divan-Orchestra-Royal-Albert-Hall-review.html

What a critic! Doesn't know the difference between woodwind and horns!

What are his credentials?

HS

[JohnSkelton]

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/culture/m...ll-review.html

What a critic! Doesn't know the difference between woodwind and horns!

What are his credentials?

HS

http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio3/features/programmes/presenters/hewett-ivan.shtml

Presumably by "the rustic dance of the scherzo" he means the (repeated) trio section. I'd imagine he does know the difference between woodwind and horns.

[Eine Alpensinfonie]

Presumably by "the rustic dance of the scherzo" he means the (repeated) trio section. I'd imagine he does know the difference between woodwind and horns.

If he does not, he wouldn't be alone. A woodwind quintet consists of flut, oboe, clarinet, bassoon and horn. Nothing logical there. Furthermore, people who know better (especially brass players) refer to "wind and brass", even though the brass family is as much "wind" as the woodwind family.