Prom 74: Saturday 10th September at 7.30 p.m. (Last Night of the Proms)

[Bert Coules]

This is interesting. As a general rule I would agree with you, but there are sometimes good reasons for omitting verses. If this original verse of the National Anthem were still to be sung, there would be a riot

Exactly: some songs are living, evolving things and the notion of authenticity isn't really applicable except in the context of an historical-recreation type of performance. It would actually be more in keeping with the original spirit of the national anthem and other similar pieces (as well as more fun) to write and insert new topical material from time to time.

[David Underdown]

No, the words to Auld Lang Syne aren't printed because it's not strictly part of the programme, but led by prommers, for prommers (and we do generally sing the right words)

[mangerton]

No, the words to Auld Lang Syne aren't printed because it's not strictly part of the programme, but led by prommers, for prommers (and we do generally sing the right words)

The prommers certainly didn't sing "the right words" last night - and they haven't for years.

[Nick Armstrong]

http://www.freesmileys.org/smileys.php

[Eine Alpensinfonie]

I see we have a new last right thread.

But returning to Auld Lang Syne, I liked it when James Louchran conducted it in quite an exciting orchestration.

[Eine Alpensinfonie]

This is interesting. As a general rule I would agree with you, but there are sometimes good reasons for omitting verses. If this original verse of the National Anthem were still to be sung, there would be a riot - and I'd be leading it:

Lord, grant that Marshal Wade,
May by thy mighty aid,
Victory bring.
May he sedition hush,
and like a torrent rush,
Rebellious Scots to crush,
God save the King.

More recently, this verse from a very well known children's hymn was written, and unsurprisingly is no longer sung:

The rich man in his castle,
The poor man at his gate,
He made them, high or lowly,
And ordered their estate.

They still sing "Hills of the North, Rejoice", which is fairly controversial.

But if we're on the subject of hymns, would you really want to sing all 9 verses of "The First Nowell"?

[Dave2002]

Next year, ditch the parks, bring back the Seasongs (sic) ....

I was going to ask what happened to them - the sea songs? When were they last performed? I really think we need them, unless of course we decide to go with Stunsworth's suggestions.

[Alison]

I have always assumed that it was the prommers, or a section of them, who effectively
ruled out the Sea Songs with their silly klaxons etc.

The current choices have curbed those excesses though I was still irritated by childish
balloon things during Pomp and Circumstance.

It's disappointing that the front row diehards havent been able influence matters.

Certainly no half heartedness from Philip Trueman in the singing !

[mangerton]

But if we're on the subject of hymns, would you really want to sing all 9 verses of "The First Nowell"?

Noooooo!!!!!! Our church choir gets upset if we have to sing more than four.

[mangerton]

The current choices have curbed those excesses though I was still irritated by childish
balloon things during Pomp and Circumstance.

I take it you mean these balloons:

http://img.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2008/03_01/promsDM0403_468x320.jpg

[Eine Alpensinfonie]

I was going to ask what happened to them - the sea songs? When were they last performed? I really think we need them, unless of course we decide to go with Stunsworth's suggestions.

They were performed last year in the "1910 Last Last Night" concert. Otherwise, I think the last time they were heard at the BBC Proms was 2007. I take the blame for their demise because I had the audacity to challenge the Chilcott insertions in 2006. Seriously though, I don't know why they were dropped.

[mercia]

I don't mind the Sea Songs as long as they miss out the Hornpipe, which encourages the balloon-popping and klaxons, and Home Sweet Home because people try unsuccessfully to hum along. Also I've never understood why See the Conquering Hero from Judas Maccabaeus is a Sea Song.

[Ferretfancy]

Just a small piece of information, really. A high proportion of regular Prommers, including quite a number of season ticket holders, don't go to the Last Night. What seems to happen is that people who never attend during the rest of the season manage to beg borrow or steal tickets. This is usually done by acquiring ticket stubs from people who have queued on the day through the preceding weeks in order to qualify for the Last Night.
I did go a couple of years ago, and found myself in a cheery group who told me that they had never been before, to be fair they did enjoy the real music part of the evening and were good company..
The oafs with air horns etc. are never seen at any other time.
The Proms in general have improved tremendously since the palmy days of Sargent and Cameron, when we heard numerous routine performances of standard works, and a few memorable ones. Travel back in a time machine would come as something of a shock where performance standards are concerned.

[BudgieJane]

Also I've never understood why See the Conquering Hero from Judas Maccabaeus is a Sea Song.

It isn't. It's a See Song

[amac4165]

Just a small piece of information, really. A high proportion of regular Prommers, including quite a number of season ticket holders, don't go to the Last Night. What seems to happen is that people who never attend during the rest of the season manage to beg borrow or steal tickets. This is usually done by acquiring ticket stubs from people who have queued on the day through the preceding weeks in order to qualify for the Last Night.
.

There did seem to be a higher number - of "ticketed" arena people this year - and the arena did seem fuller than last year or 2005. (2011, 2011 and 2005 being my only experience since 1988) Also it was my impression less boxes were decorated - this year. I think people have cottoned on that you can get a ticket to the arena on the last night.