Prom 70: Wednesday 7th September at 7.00 p.m. (Bridge, Birtwistle, Holst)

[Petrushka]

I'm confused... is this a positive or a negative report?

Presume you mean me, WH? I'm a bit confused myself to be honest about whether to be positive or negative about this Planets. Probably both in equal measure.

[Chris Newman]

Well, I am rather late this evening having watched some programmes on art on TV. Thanks to iPlayer I thought the Bridge was lovely English stuff. It was new to me. There were moments when I kept expecting it to turn into the RVW Wasps Overture (probably my fault for telling an RVW joke on another thread this morning). Robertson and the BBCSO orchestra sounded on much more friendly terms than the last time I heard them in Beethoven 9.

Last night I tried to like the Rihm Second Violin Concerto but it did seem stuck in a rut and not getting anywhere though I do sincerely believe we have to be thankful though to Anne Sophie Mutter for continuing to try and plough the field of contemporary music. So until this evening I have only really been impressed by Graham Fitkin's beautiful Cello Concerto for Yo Yo Ma and with a few revisions Colin Matthews's moving No Man's Land as pieces of new music I would go to hear again. Then hey! Tonight has broken the dearth of good new pieces: dear Harry Birtwistle comes up with a super new (to Britain) Violin Concerto. Evocatively atmospheric, full of variety and designed to make good use of the virtuosic skills of soloist and orchestra. I hope that this in an augur that in his later years Sir Harry is finding a delightful and lyrical musical voice in the same way that Sir Peter Maxwell Davies and Sir Michael Tippett have done. I like this new work very much. Congratulations to Sir Harry, Christian Tetzlaff and the BBCSO. It sounds as if it was well received.

[jayne lee wilson]

Yes, it was an extraordinary moment! Engineer didn't see it coming, thank goodness!

Even I, ever tolerant of those interstitial applauders and bronchial society members, have to say that tonight...
oh, for god's sake... Or, BE QUIET! or **** *** or something. Mite excessive, perhaps, bit end-of-term?
Perhaps a real prommer, as opposed to a virtual one like me, could tell us what was going on...
Was it reassurance after that Beethoven 9, "don't worry, we still love you, we're still on your side!"

The Planets veered between plodding, blazing, and a few times, quite beautiful, evocative, poetical... you could easily be in more than two minds about it.

Let's hope Tetzlaff (or anyone!) records the Birtwistle soon, along with how many other pieces of his that never made it to disc in the last 2 decades, Exody for one. Still, there's a Sunday PM repeat of this one.

I thought everyone had gone to sleep - then all of a sudden it went hurtling into the abyss. The organ glissando in Uranus sounded as if the roof had collapsed. What with the coughers and applauders the Planets at the Proms is no longer an attractive prospect as far as I am concerned.

[prokkyshosty]

In re: the applauding. Lots of kiddies in the hall tonight, and it seemed like a couple of school groups were milling about before the performance, so they might have been in there as well. Once the clapping started, David Robertson seemed to encourage it by acknowledging it each time so it sort of grew in intensity; that is, up until Saturn, when an extremely loud noise from somewhere in the back threw everybody off their game, including the clappers.

The Planets is such a wonderful introduction to the power of an orchestra concert; the applauders hopefully will be seasoned pros in a couple years, now that they've gotten their first taste of it!

[Eine Alpensinfonie]

Coughers, clappers, goodness knows whatelsers!! They should all be shot at dawn! Spoils the atmosphere!

Hear! hear!

As for "there's no atmosphere between planets", one might add that there is therefore complete silence.

These intrusive applauders will never learn good manners unless they are given good leadership.

[mercia]

the applauders hopefully will be seasoned pros in a couple [of] years

there'll be a new lot by then inter-movement applause doesn't usually bother me much but it did last night, I think because the different Planet movements are relatively short, so it felt more of an interruption. I think I would like Mars to have begun in the tempo it ended up in. Curious to know what it says in the score at this point, is there a big rallentando followed by a new quicker tempo as we heard last night?

[Flay]

No, it changes from 5/2 to 5/4 and from an mf crescendo to fff but no indication on the score of an actual tempo change.

But I'm glad it happened!

http://imslp.info/files/imglnks/usimg/f/f5/IMSLP24899-PMLP33488-Holst-PlanetsFS1.pdf

(pages 20/21)

[mercia]

oh thanks for going to the trouble Flay (hope you didn't miss your bus/train/plane/boat)

[Roehre]

Last night I tried to like the Rihm Second Violin Concerto but it did seem stuck in a rut and not getting anywhere though I do sincerely believe we have to be thankful though to Anne Sophie Mutter for continuing to try and plough the field of contemporary music. So until this evening I have only really been impressed by Graham Fitkin's beautiful Cello Concerto for Yo Yo Ma and with a few revisions Colin Matthews's moving No Man's Land as pieces of new music I would go to hear again. Then hey! Tonight has broken the dearth of good new pieces: dear Harry Birtwistle comes up with a super new (to Britain) Violin Concerto. Evocatively atmospheric, full of variety and designed to make good use of the virtuosic skills of soloist and orchestra. I hope that this in an augur that in his later years Sir Harry is finding a delightful and lyrical musical voice in the same way that Sir Peter Maxwell Davies and Sir Michael Tippett have done. I like this new work very much. Congratulations to Sir Harry, Christian Tetzlaff and the BBCSO. It sounds as if it was well received.

On re-listening to the Birtwistle concerto (I had been able to listen to its premiere performance) I have to say that it is an IMO wunderful piece, which -I hope- reaches a CD.
There is one thing however which did escape my attention the first time I heard it: actually it exists nearly completely of music with a slow pulse, despite the quick and fast music played by the soloist or his discussion partners in the orchestra.

Birtwistle realised fully his aim to hear the violinist throughout, which -as he remarked- is unfortunately often not the case in violin concertos (and not only recent ones, I haste to add, try Szymanowski's 2nd concerto to have a brilliant example of what is meant here).

IMO Rihm's Gesungene Zeit is a lasting piece. I haven't listened to its Prom performance, but the recording on DGG (early 1990s) shows that -for me- it keeps being interesting after repeated and intensive listening. (The Berg on that CD is brilliant, btw)
I agree re the Fitkin piece, but No Man's Land IMO suffers a bit of the gadgets used, though certainly at first hearing it appears to be an interesting work. Whether it is after repeated listening, I am doubtful.

[BudgieJane]

an extremely loud noise from somewhere in the back

That was someone fainting.

[EnemyoftheStoat]

That was someone fainting.

Someone? It sounded as if an elephant had keeled over.

[Bryn]

Once the clapping started, David Robertson seemed to encourage it by acknowledging it each time ...

And why should he not? Too much "I am a real classical music lover" bigotry in going on in this thread, and others seeking to tell paying audience members when not to applaud. Apart from anything else, The Planets is a suite from which individual pieces are often played alone. Get a grip, you moaning Minnies, and start concentrating on the music rather than how your fellow audience members show their appreciation for it.

[mercia]

did anyone hear Anthony Payne, before the Holst, citing Stravinsky and Schoenberg as the main influences on it? that had not occured to me though I can't offer anything better.

[prokkyshosty]

Also, Debussy and Ravel, for Venus and Neptune, mostly.

Oh, and Jupiter: The Bringer of Elgar.

[Nachtigall]

And why should he not? Too much "I am a real classical music lover" bigotry in going on in this thread.

Nonsense.