Prom 30: Saturday 6th August ay 6.30 p.m. (NYO)

[Ventilhorn]

I tuned into BBC2 tonight specifically for the Britten and was most impressed with the soloist's way with his namesake's concerto! I think it's a remarkable work, although like others I rate the violon concerto even more highly. It seemed to me that Benjamin Grosvenor was equal to the demands the Op. 13 makes of the soloist. He's really, as they say, 'something else' - an extraordinary talent.

Yes indeed. A wonderful talent, as we have already noted from his previous performances.

Why is then, that I get a feeling of unease, watching his facial expression as he plays?

He's only 19 years old. Is he going to progress further or is he suddenly going to hit a blank wall in his mid twenties?

I sincerely hope not, but I've seen it happen to other musical prodigies and it causes me a certain unease.

VH

[Ariosto]

I enjoyed the shear pianistic skill of Ben last night but thought the whole thing was too highly paced and blame rehearsals for that. The conductor should have used his skills to slow the orchestra down and give more light and shade because, as it was, it was too monochrome.

Yes, his pianistic skills are extremely high. I wonder, along with ventilhorn, how he will fare as time goes on, but I can only wish him well and say that I also find his "looks" a bit disturbing sometimes. I felt that the Britten concerto was conducted with rigid tempos - maybe playing safe to keep it from falling apart. BG obviously knew the work intimately and fitted with the orchestra rather than the other way around. It takes courage and ability in no small measure to be able to accomplish that.

The orchestra at times played well in the R & J but there was no shape (as in the Britten) and no musical definition. It's a very long and hard piece, and perhaps they played too much of it. Not really a good choice, and the conductor gave them no help at all. Even so some good playing from the fiddles in some of those very fast passages, where they played as an ensemble, and with each other.

Imagine how much better it would have been to have had Barenboim conducting, where he always adjusts his conducting to help the players (as in the NW Divan orchestra concerts) - and where he gives a highly defined musical shape to a work.

I must say I thought the NYO conductor (Vladimir Jurowski ) was really a bit of a waste of space. Why do they do this to youth orchestras?

I'm afraid the other gripe I have is that the BBC balance was very bad. I could hear sliders being wound up and down, and with 50 plus mics it was a disaster. Will they never learn?

[Norfolk Born]

I've not heard of the NW Divan Orchestra - was it originally formed to perform Bernard Herrmann's score for my favourite Hitchcock film (think Mt. Rushmore)?

[Ariosto]

I've not heard of the NW Divan Orchestra - was it originally formed to perform Bernard Herrmann's score for my favourite Hitchcock film (think Mt. Rushmore)?

If I've got it right its the North West Divan Orchestra - a youth orchestra started by Barenboim and Edward Said a few years ago. It is made up of Palestinians and Israelis in the hope of bringing together the young musicians from both areas. Baremboim did a Prom with them two or three years ago, and it was an excellent example of what can be done with a young orchestra with the right guidance, musically and morally.

[amateur51]

If I've got it right its the North West Divan Orchestra - a youth orchestra started by Barenboim and Edward Said a few years ago. It is made up of Palestinians and Israelis in the hope of bringing together the young musicians from both areas. Baremboim did a Prom with them two or three years ago, and it was an excellent example of what can be done with a young orchestra with the right guidance, musically and morally.

You've got your compass all squiffy, Arisoto - it's the West-Eastern Divan orchestra

http://www.west-eastern-divan.org/

[Norfolk Born]

I think you'll find it's the East-West Divan Orchestra (a possible reference to a work by Goethe).
EDIT/CORRECTION: Make that West-Eastern, as correctly pointed out just now.

[Ariosto]

You've got your compass all squiffy, Arisoto - it's the West-Eastern Divan orchestra

http://www.west-eastern-divan.org/

Yes, I've just realised that having googled them!! Sorry, must be something nasty settling in! But my recall of the performance is still there!! (Just).

[Suffolkcoastal]

I watched the BBC2 broadcast last night. The G Prokofiev piece was dreadful, not all to do with the turntables element either, the orchestration was bad, except in sections in which it sounded like his Grandfather's orchestration, and the piece itself had no shape or interesting features in it whatsoever. I agree about the Britten sounding monochrome, BG's playing was indeed stunning, but, as several others have commented, the orchestra seem to have little light or shade and made Britten's orchestration sound dull. The same with the selections from Romeo and Juliet, though there was some very fine playing the performance was very matter-of-fact and it at times seemed that conductor and orchestra were 'bored'.

[Ariosto]

I watched the BBC2 broadcast last night. The G Prokofiev piece was dreadful, not all to do with the turntables element either, the orchestration was bad, except in sections in which it sounded like his Grandfather's orchestration, and the piece itself had no shape or interesting features in it whatsoever. I agree about the Britten sounding monochrome, BG's playing was indeed stunning, but, as several others have commented, the orchestra seem to have little light or shade and made Britten's orchestration sound dull. The same with the selections from Romeo and Juliet, though there was some very fine playing the performance was very matter-of-fact and it at times seemed that conductor and orchestra were 'bored'.

I did not comment on the G Prokofiev piece but I'm pleased to see someone with similar thoughts to mine. I did say to my partner that I thought it was a work of genius but she knew I was being sarcastic ... (ME, sarcastic, never!!)

With a different starting piece and a more careful choice of final half it could have been a much better concert - EVEN with the involvement of Mr Jurowski on the box.

[Mary Chambers]

The G. Prokofiev piece might have been quite entertaining as a novelty item for five minutes, but it went on and on with no more to say.

I find Benjamin Grosvenor slightly scary, though brilliant. I can't recall seeing such intense concentration (even on the easy bits!) from any other pianist. Obviously all good pianists have to concentrate hard, but it doesn't always show so much. Fabulous playing, however.

Interesting and worrying contrast between these teenagers and the rioters.

[Ariosto]

The G. Prokofiev piece might have been quite entertaining as a novelty item for five minutes, but it went on and on with no more to say.

I find Benjamin Grosvenor slightly scary, though brilliant. I can't recall seeing such intense concentration (even on the easy bits!) from any other pianist. Obviously all good pianists have to concentrate hard, but it doesn't always show so much. Fabulous playing, however.

Interesting and worrying contrast between these teenagers and the rioters.

Good comments about the G Prok piece and Bengy, Mary.

Maybe there is not so much difference between the rioters and the NYO - perhaps some of the NYO'ers are into similar things, like drugs, sex and aquisitions, but it's less obvious, and they come from privilged although not always affluent backgrounds. They are usually more highly educated too, so they know the arguments and the results of letting things get out of hand.

Sometimes members of youth orchestras * live it up when away from home, and you get the odd member who will try and drink a whole bottle of whiskey in the space of an hour, with dangerous consequencies. That's why there are adults around to sort them out and get a doctor and help if needed.

You may think I'm exagerating but I do know some of these young people, and some of the people that look after them.

* As do professional symphony and opera orchestras too!! I could tell you a tale or two.

[Stanfordian]

I always like to hear contemporary ‘serious’ music and over the years have attended many concerts of music from the Second Viennese School; Berio; Boulez; Nono et al. But Gabriel Prokofiev’s Concerto For Turntables and Orchestra was truly awful. Terrible scratching about on the decks and such poor orchestration in my view. I hope the BBC didn’t waste money on commissioning this work. Apart from being the grandson of the great Sergei Prokofiev I am wondering what Gabriel Prokofiev has done to deserve having a Proms performance of his works.

[BudgieJane]

I could hear sliders being wound up and down

How do you wind sliders up and down?

[salymap]

Good comments about the G Prok piece and Bengy, Mary.

Maybe there is not so much difference between the rioters and the NYO - perhaps some of the NYO'ers are into similar things, like drugs, sex and aquisitions, but it's less obvious, and they come from privilged although not always affluent backgrounds. They are usually more highly educated too, so they know the arguments and the results of letting things get out of hand.

Sometimes members of youth orchestras * live it up when away from home, and you get the odd member who will try and drink a whole bottle of whiskey in the space of an hour, with dangerous consequencies. That's why there are adults around to sort them out and get a doctor and help if needed.

You may think I'm exagerating but I do know some of these young people, and some of the people that look after them.

* As do professional symphony and opera orchestras too!! I could tell you a tale or two.

I read a
newspaper articlesomeyears ago about the parties the LPO got up to when touring abroad. I am surprised they were allowed to print details of someof their 'party games'. We all know they go home after a concert to a cup ofcocoa and an early night, don't they ARIOSTO ?

[Chris Newman]

Once again this was a concert where the sound heard on TV was nothing like that in the concert hall.

The first half sound was better balanced than the second: indeed the audience at home heard the turntables more clearly than we could in the arena. The Britten was well balanced. Once again the sound crew were scared by the sheer volume in parts of the Prokofiev and to paraphrase Ariosto "I could hear winders beeing slid up and down." The same problem is very apparent with the opening of Reizenstein's Concerto Populare in the radio version of the Comedy Prom where the engineers are terrified by the brass playing the Tchaikovsky First Piano Concerto.

Still, I enjoyed all of the concert. The G Prokofiev was fascinating and I enjoyed hearing it again. It grows on me. The Britten was remarkably played, the encore was a tad fast but fun and the Romeo and Juliet great.