How does Sonos sound?

[Guest]

After much confusion and trawling through many threads I think I have decided that in order to play my 500GB+ music collection (320kbps mp3 and FLAC stored on an external hard drive) I would like a Sonos 5 with ethernet connectivity (through wall plugs) and a bridge so that I can play my collection downstairs in my lounge. I know I can use my Samsung Galaxy Note to control it and am happy with the price (around £450 all in). My question is: do any audiophiles own a Sonos and does it produce acceptable sound for classical (my speciality being opera and choral music). I am not expecting too much as I have been without a decent system for years and rely on my Teufel PC speakers for serious listening (albeit while I work) but would be interested if my £500 is better spent elsewhere or if I need to rethink my expectations and spend more? Many thanks in advance.

One other question - would the Sonos "wake" my laptop from sleep mode if I wished to play music or would I have to manually do that?

[johnb]

I can't comment too much on the Sonus specifically (being a Squeezebox Touch user) but you should be fine. It's probable that using a separate DAC (rather than relying on the one built into the Sonus kit) will be beneficial but whether the additional cost is worthwhile will depend on you and the rest of your audio system.

It's worth pointing out that the Sonus system only seems to support up to 44.1/16 (the CD standard) so it is likely that anything higher will either be automatically resampled down to 44.1/16 or not play at all.

One critical thing to consider is the search facilities of the Sonus kit and the way that ties in with how your mp3 and FLAC files are tagged.

It looks as though the Sonus might not support WoL (Wake on Lan), unlike the Squeezebox Touch. If you use an iPad, say, as a controller you can probably work round this by getting an iPad app that will send a "magic packet" to your laptop to wake it up. You will probably have to enable WoL in the laptop BIOS and/or Network Card settings. (Or course, WoL will only work if the laptop is in "sleep" or "standby" mode, not when hibernating or switched off.)

[Phileas]

I don't personally own a Sonos player but there is no reason to suppose it won't sound as good as anything else, even the most high-end CD player/streamer. There's no excuse nowadays for reasonably priced digital front-ends to have any audible shortcomings.

[Resurrection Man]

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One critical thing to consider is the search facilities of the Sonus kit and the way that ties in with how your mp3 and FLAC files are tagged.

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This is absolutely crucial. Try and get hold of a manual to see how you file/access stuff. Hopefully it won't be as bad as the Brennan!

[Nevalti]

I have no experience of the Sonos 5 but I have used Sonos for years feeding from Zoneplayers into 'proper' hifi systems. There are two drawbacks that will undoubtedly be shared by the Sonos 5. The Sonos electronic volume control absolutely ruins the sound quality (but you can by-pass that) and the DACs are only mediocre. Using a decent DAC and the main amp's volume control it is a match for virtually any CD player I have heard. It is good enough that I abandoned my CD player and I rely almost completely on the Sonos and a SB Touch (for Hi Res). I use my BlueRay player if I actually need to spin a CD.

The control and searching systems for Sonos are excellent but do bear in mind that, as mentioned earlier, the Sonos can not handle anything above 44.1/16, it simple doesn't play them, BUT I have yet to be convinced that there is any audible advantage in HiRes. I feel that there should be so I remain open minded about the benefits for the time being. Obviously anyone feeling or believing that HiRes music sounds better than CDs should think twice before buying a Sonos.

[Nick Armstrong]

This is absolutely crucial. Try and get hold of a manual to see how you file/access stuff. Hopefully it won't be as bad as the Brennan!

That is very interesting, Rezza. I've toyed with the idea of the Brennan. If the search function is pants I won't do so any more.

Searchability seems to be the achilles heel of a lot of technology. The 1TB hard drive in the PVR/BluRay under the telly at home sounds terrific, but once even half full, it takes so long to access some of the 500GB of earlier recordings (you can only sort them chronologically or alphabetically - so if you recorded something beginning with 'M' a year ago, you're b*****ed, you have to click manually through 50 - 60 pages, looking at each item on each page) - you end up never watching or accessing (or even remembering) half the stuff on it. Absolutely no search facility at all. That machine is 2 years old, but I recently looked around at some of the most recent (May 2013) pieces of kit and none that I can see offered sensible search facilities either. (Plus the amount of stored data slows the whole machine down, but that's another moan).

[Nevalti]

I don't personally own a Sonos player but there is no reason to suppose it won't sound as good as anything else, even the most high-end CD player/streamer. There's no excuse nowadays for reasonably priced digital front-ends to have any audible shortcomings.

That is rather optimistic Phileas! Almost any CD player will outperform the unassisted Sonos. The Sonos volume control absolutely ruins the SQ and should be locked out. The DAC is fair but nowhere near as good as a decent dedicated DAC nor the DAC in a reasonable CD player.

There are huge differences between DACs I'm afraid, despite rumours that they are all the same. Do you remember when CD players first appeared? Some pundits were telling us that they all sounded the same so there was no need to pay a lot for a CD player! Huh! Most of them did sound the same - awful.

Some people even tell you that all amplifiers sound the same and they seem to be serious too

Fortunately things continue to improve but I see no reason to believe that we have arrived at audio perfection just yet.

[Phileas]

Nevalti

I was really only thinking about the Sonos analogue line-out fed into a pre-amp, but even a digital volume control should be fine for most purposes if competently implemented.

Obviously we'll have to disagree about whether DACs sound the same but I have read that a problem with early CD players was that the high levels of RF noise produced by them reacted with some amplifiers to produce a harsh sound. Although this problem was quickly fixed, the damage to CD's reputation was not so easily repaired.

It could also be true that some amplifiers even today react badly to some CD players/DACs.

[Nevalti]

I was really only thinking about the Sonos analogue line-out fed into a pre-amp, but even a digital volume control should be fine for most purposes if competently implemented.

Hmmmmmm..... You obviously need to try it for yourself and listen. I did try to do away with analogue by feeding my FM tuner into a Zoneplayer but that means you are using a mediocre ADC as well as a mediocre DAC, if you are using a 'naked' Sonos. Obviously the best DAC in the world can not undo the damage of a mediocre ADC.

The digital processing of their volume control simply ruins the quality and you really should listen for yourself on a decent system. Fortunately Sonos are well aware of this problem and very sensibly provide the facility to lock-out the volume control. Apart from the lack of HiRes capability, I find Sonos equipment excellent - as long as you understand and work around it's inherent limitations.

Obviously we'll have to disagree about whether DACs sound the same...

Yep. I prefer to use my ears.

It could also be true that some amplifiers even today react badly to some CD players/DACs.

Well of course they do. No two CD players sound the same and no two amps sound the same. If you select a 'bright' sounding CD player and a 'bright' sounding amp - guess what it will sound like. If you feed that silly combination into 'bright' sounding speakers you will probably only survive one track before having to turn it off or run out of the room with your ears bleeding