Fibre routers and modems

[Dave2002]

I've just received notification that so-called superfast broadband is now available in our area. Seems that installation is required, and this will include a fibre router and a fibre modem. Is the input connection to these really a fibre optic cable, or are they simply electrical/electronic devices, with any fibre connections being done in the network outside the house? Has FTTH finally arrived in the UK?

Does anyone have experience of these fibre routers and modems?

[mercia]

a few weeks ago BT started sending me letters saying BT Infinity was now available in my area and why didn't I go over to it for no extra cost except installation - so I agreed [and to be perfectly honest haven't noticed any difference in speed as a result]. I don't begin to understand the technology but I notice wikipedia calls BT Infinity FTTC - "fibre to the cabinet".

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BT_Infinity

EDIT - sorry, just realised that BT Infinity isn't really the superfast broadband you are talking about

[Stunsworth]

I'm with Virgin, and it's fibre up to a small box outside the house, from then on its copper coax that plugs into the back of the router.

i recently had a free upgrade to 60 meg, and to my surprise that's what I get for much of the time. The update involved them sending me a new modem/router. Self installation was very easy.

if you want to test the speed of your connection try www.speedtest.net

[mercia]

the BT website offers me a speed test, then says to get accurate results I should attach my computer to the hub thingy via ethernet - which seems to me to be rather pointless since that isn't how I habitually use my computer


confused of Tunbridge Wells

[MrGongGong]

Surely they are NOT "modems" ?
as the signal is not modulated / demodulated ?

[Dave2002]

a few weeks ago BT started sending me letters saying BT Infinity was now available in my area and why didn't I go over to it for no extra cost except installation - so I agreed [and to be perfectly honest haven't noticed any difference in speed as a result]. I don't begin to understand the technology but I notice wikipedia calls BT Infinity FTTC - "fibre to the cabinet".

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BT_Infinity

EDIT - sorry, just realised that BT Infinity isn't really the superfast broadband you are talking about

My current provider is TalkTalk, and they are claiming that their superfast broadband will go up to 76 Mbps. I suspect that most providers will use BT anyway, unless they have developed via the cable TV route.

Re modems and routers (MrGG) AFAIK fibre systems mostly (always?) use ASK in some form or other - either the "light" is on or off. There may be more to it than that though, as I suspect that the data stream is "modulated" with a pseudo random bit string in order to avoid other technical problems [e.g if there is a long string of 0s or 1s in the data]. The modem presumably goes at the end of the fibre (and may be outside the house), and then links to a wireless/wired router inside the house for internal networking. That's my guess, anyway.

They want a minimum of £10 per month extra, which seems a bit steep to me, given that I think other providers could take over the service for less overall.

[Frances_iom]

BT infinity consists of 2 portions - BT Openreach will have a fibre to near your house terminating in a BT box from which it will use the short run of copper(your telephone line) to reach the house - this is then terminated at a modem - this modem then connects to a router/wifi access device (you land up with 2 relatively small boxes sitting on top of each other - the gateway that terminates the openreach link + the router proving your access) - I'm not sure exactly what protocol is used from openreach (the box which has just one working 'Lan' connection runs its own 'locked' program tho it is apparently possible to unlock it) - the 2nd router appears to act like a cable 'modem' (ie using a different protocol than used over ADSL) hardwired to access the net via the openreach box - BT has a backdoor access into both boxes and can control both (ie avoids the usual customer problems) - however there is a rumour that this backdoor is 'hackable' by others using the wifi link.

[OldTechie]

I think the only ISP offering fibre all the way to the home is Google - and you have to live in Kansas City to get it...

http://news.cnet.com/8301-1023_3-57481108-93/google-shows-isps-how-to-build-a-superfast-network/

My Virgin Media connection is a coaxial cable from the house to a local cabinet at the end of the street, then a fibre backbone. BT Infinity has recently become available, and I think it uses the normal BT twisted pair cable from the home to the local cabinet, and then a fibre backbone. The BT site says I could get 61.2 Mb download and 20 Mb upload. I guess the 61.2 Mb limit is based on the length of twisted pair from my house to the street cabinet.

Both Virgin Media and BT have to modulate the data on a complex system to get it down the final link, so you do have to have a modem to convert it to standard ethernet and Wi Fi. BT Infinity uses VDSL2 technology instead of the ADSL of the usual data-over-telephone-line ISP connections. Virgin Media suffers with being an amalgamation of multiple companies and has various technologies in different areas and for different data rates, and they have a separate cable TV distribution which shares the final cable to the home.

[Stunsworth]

the BT website offers me a speed test, then says to get accurate results I should attach my computer to the hub thingy via ethernet - which seems to me to be rather pointless since that isn't how I habitually use my computer

It's just a way of getting the real speed unaffected by wireless. Some people may be using older, slower, wireless protocols and blame the router when in fact it's a wireless issue.

[Stunsworth]

The modem presumably goes at the end of the fibre (and may be outside the house), and then links to a wireless/wired router inside the house for internal networking. That's my guess, anyway

That's not the way Virgin work. The modem and the wireless router are in the same enclosure - next to the TV in my case.

[Dave2002]

I think the only ISP offering fibre all the way to the home is Google - and you have to live in Kansas City to get it...

http://news.cnet.com/8301-1023_3-57481108-93/google-shows-isps-how-to-build-a-superfast-network/

I thought some of the Baltic states, such as Latvia, were leap frogging the rest of us, and at least providing fibre to the building, though buildings may not in fact be homes and could be commercial premises.

[MrGongGong]

I wonder at what point will the price of copper be such that it becomes economically viable to strip out all the 6 strand phone cable (of which only two are used) in the UK ?

[clive heath]

We've just had "fibre" and our speed at this laptop has gone up from 3 Mbps to 38 Mbps although the "bt beta" test claims not to be accurate above 20 Mbps. Talk Talk brought the price down to a fiver a month, just harangue them. Threaten to leave! Certainly when I uploaded some stuff to my site it took way way less time (upload 1.85 Mbps) than before. There was a letter in the Times suggesting that any part of the link being copper would make the process useless. Not so here. The fibre effectively reduces the copper distance from the exchange to just the distance from the local "Green Box", hardly ever more than a few hundred yards away. The two boxes sit in the top room and its wifi to here, ground floor, and we still get that reading! I don't know if this helps anyone who is undecided. I haven't had a chance to test it yet but I guess I won't get Radio3 HD hanging up on me again. Also I-player should be good. Will report if not.

PS "here" is West London

[scottycelt]

We've just had "fibre" and our speed at this laptop has gone up from 3 Mbps to 38 Mbps although the "bt beta" test claims not to be accurate above 20 Mbps. Talk Talk brought the price down to a fiver a month, just harangue them. Threaten to leave! Certainly when I uploaded some stuff to my site it took way way less time (upload 1.85 Mbps) than before. There was a letter in the Times suggesting that any part of the link being copper would make the process useless. Not so here. The fibre effectively reduces the copper distance from the exchange to just the distance from the local "Green Box", hardly ever more than a few hundred yards away. The two boxes sit in the top room and its wifi to here, ground floor, and we still get that reading! I don't know if this helps anyone who is undecided. I haven't had a chance to test it yet but I guess I won't get Radio3 HD hanging up on me again. Also I-player should be good. Will report if not.

PS "here" is West London

I've had fibre for nearly two years now. Our house is over a mile from the exchange and our previous max speed of 5meg is now over 50meg. The 'engineer' told me that having fibre is the equivalent of moving the exchange to the nearest green box which is 200 yards away. The next stage is running fibre from the box to the house which will increase the speed further and I understand some areas are already geared for this to happen.

There is simply no comparison with traditional copper. I know of no one who has switched to fibre and not been delighted with the huge difference in speed.

[MrGongGong]

PS "here" is West London

So I guess there's no connection between your internet speed and the speed of the traffic on the Hammersmith flyover ?
or is it the only thing that moves in your neck of the woods ?