Smart TVs - clever or dumb?

[Dave2002]

We recently bought a so-called "smart" TV - a Toshiba 49 inch, since it was on offer. I had no experience of these before. It was initially a pain to set up, and indeed we have so far failed to get it to work with broadcast TV, either Freeview or Freesat - but that's not the problem with the TV.

Without a good signal to get the TV up and running it took a while to find work arounds. For some months now we have been watching a lot of TV purely via the internet, using external boxes - Roku, Now TV etc. The new set has internet built in.

The manual - even the downloadable "full" version - seemed next to useless - though perseverence (and help from some other forums) has now got the set working, and gradually everything is starting to work in a usable way. At first I got the set working with the NowTV units, though NowTV does not support full HD or UHD. After a day or so I found out how to get some of the apps working on the TV, and now it's not strictly necessary to use an external box any more - if there is an app installed on the TV.

What I've not managed to do is to rearrange the apps on the TV so as not to show a menu of the ones we'd be unlikely to use. I've also not managed to install new apps on the TV which could be accessed directly from the TV menu.

I found this very interesting site - https://www.lifewire.com/how-to-add-...art-tv-4172379 - which indicates the great variety of different possibilities, depending on the brand of TV etc. It seems that there is some diversity amongst different manufacturers, though most are using some form of "standard" platform - but the set manufacturers are not going to burden most users with the trouble of knowing that their set might be Roku or Chromecast enabled, or how to use the different systems.

Probably few readers here will have experimented to this level, but some might. It may be that these TVs are too "clever" (or stupid) for the average user to manage. I shall ignore any wag who suggests that it is not the TV which is stupid . I'd be interested also to know how these sets go down in the US where I suspect most of the sets are sold in variants, or at least the manufacturers/brands have customised versions for the US market, and where probably the commonly available and commonly used online services are rather different.

[JimD]

Slightly elliptical to your point (though I had similar problems with a Toshiba 'smart' TV several years ago) but I find that for most devices these days instructions are (intentionally?) fairly minimal. You seem to be expected to know intuitively or by trial and error. My daughter (now 23) seems to find my expectations of instructions mildly pitiable. Perhaps this is an inevitable result of devices' complexity/constant 'upgrading'. Manufacturers tend to tell you what the devices can do (in gee whizz register) but not how to get them to do it.

[pastoralguy]

I spend a lot of time in other people's houses in my professional capacity. It's my experience that there is not one gadget that manufacturers can't make more complicated. One house has toaster that is so clever that it doesn't actually make toast!

[Keraulophone]

Our new Sony smart TV is so clever that the sound actually comes out of the screen. I could hardly believe it at first, but apparently it’s an ‘Acoustic Surface’ with sound actuators fixed behind it. Speech seems to come straight out of people’s mouths!

Also, it’s great to have apps like the Berlin Phil’s Digital Concert Hall available at the touch of a button (or even a voice command) on the big screen.

[ardcarp]

Slightly elliptical to your point (though I had similar problems with a Toshiba 'smart' TV several years ago) but I find that for most devices these days instructions are (intentionally?) fairly minimal. You seem to be expected to know intuitively or by trial and error. My daughter (now 23) seems to find my expectations of instructions mildly pitiable. Perhaps this is an inevitable result of devices' complexity/constant 'upgrading'. Manufacturers tend to tell you what the devices can do (in gee whizz register) but not how to get them to do it.

I've often wondered why smart gadgets (and their terribly smart technical innovators) aren't smart enough to make them usable by the elderly confused (e.g. me). Why can't an i-phone, for instance, have a simple mode of operation with big screen-icons, big 'keys' and big print. Apple does employ a sort of universal logic in its products which, along with innovation and upgrading, is well-understood by a younger generation, a generation which is not afraid to prod about until they get a result. Mrs A and I have got the hang of the basics, but we have many friends and relatives who simply cannot use smart phones or tablets. One friend, who sadly has Parkinsons and is in residential care, can't even switch on his TV or select a programme (let alone enjoy the delights of i-player) without help from the staff. Again, surely a simple mode of operation should be available as standard?

Interestingly in the world of marine electronic gadgets (VHF, Chartplotters, AIS, Radar, Depth-Wind-Speed indicators) things have got SIMPLER to operate, the idea being that a sailor can operate the kit on a dark, wet, windy night when dog-tired on the dog-watch. Maybe a lesson to learn here?

[french frank]

Do you get better programmes?

[MrGongGong]

I spend a lot of time in other people's houses in my professional capacity.

I didn't have you down as one of Bill's mates

[pastoralguy]

I didn't have you down as one of Bill's mates

[Dave2002]

Do you get better programmes?

To whom are you addressing this question?

There is some "better" stuff to be had - though of course that's subjective. You can probably get most of the programmes by subscribing to different sites and using an external box, but the smart TVs could make that easier for some people. Many people might find that they're only slightly better than "dumb" ones, as it might require too much effort for most of them to do better than that.

Smart TVs can't work miracles.

[Richard Tarleton]

Last time round I bought a Samsung smart TV - 32", the biggest we've got room for - which I'm very happy with. Netflix greatly expands the choice available - both original stuff like The Crown and its back catalogue of box sets from other channels plus a huge film archive - and of course there's You Tube and iPlayer, etc., so well worth having. I got the man from Curry's to set it up, watched him closely, and although he clearly hadn't been on the Instructional Techniques training course I picked up enough from him to be able to take it from there. I even bought a remote keyboard at the same time (which connects remotely with the TV via a small clip USB thingy, well there was a sale on) which makes searching and putting in your password a bit quicker. At nearly 70 I seem to be coping OK. We don't watch a huge amount from Netflix, we're pretty selective, but it's definitely a quantum leap from "dumb" TVs.

I have no intention of getting one of those things you can talk to to change channels, that way madness lies.

[Richard Tarleton]

Last time round I bought a Samsung smart TV - 32", the biggest we've got room for - which I'm very happy with. Netflix greatly expands the choice available - both original stuff like The Crown and its back catalogue of box sets from other channels plus a huge film archive - and of course there's You Tube and iPlayer, etc., so well worth having. I got the man from Curry's to set it up, watched him closely, and although he clearly hadn't been on the Instructional Techniques training course I picked up enough from him to be able to take it from there. I even bought a remote keyboard at the same time (which connects remotely with the TV via a small clip USB thingy, well there was a sale on) which makes searching and putting in your password a bit quicker. At nearly 70 I seem to be coping OK. We don't watch a huge amount from Netflix, we're pretty selective, but it's definitely a quantum leap from "dumb" TVs.

I have no intention of getting one of those things you can talk to to change channels, that way madness lies.

[Dave2002]

For those who use Amazon and aren't horrified by the so-called "tax dodging" (it's not great, but it's legal, and needs to be addressed), and find it useful to use Prime, there is quite a range of film offerings in Prime video which can be set up to work with these TVs - though maybe you need an Amazon Fire stick to do that.

I have no intention of getting one of those things you can talk to to change channels, that way madness lies.

The Fire stick does have a button which is supposed to do that. I think it's safe enough if you don't press the button. Tried it anyway, and it didn't work!

NowTV is quite good, but currently is only in relatively low picture quality/resolution - which doesn't matter so much on small TVs.
It's supposed to be getting higher resolution and quality later on this year I think.

We have only tried Netflix trials a couple of times, and managed to watch Series 1 and 2 of the Crown - which others here really wanted to see.

Using a keyboard with one of these TVs - can they all do that? Do you need a special keyboard. It's a real pain trying to put in passwords using the remote. Those channels which say something like "don't panic, you only have to do this once" - wrong! If there are a 100 channels you might want to use, and perhaps half a dozen devices, that's 600 times. Most people won't try that many, but it's quite easy to get upto 5 or more attempts.

[Richard Tarleton]

Using a keyboard with one of these TVs - can they all do that? Do you need a special keyboard.

Don't know - I simply asked the TV guy in Currys for a remote keyboard that would talk to the TV I was buying....the crucial thing is the little USB clip, which I nearly didn't spot and nearly threw out with the packaging - it goes in a USB port on the side of the telly. Much easier than keying in with your TV remote.

[Keraulophone]

Smart TVs can't work miracles.

Mine can.

(vide #4)

[Keraulophone]

I have no intention of getting one of those things you can talk to to change channels, that way madness lies.

'One of those things' came with my smart TV and I think I'm still sane after asking it to do things, although my family would probably disagree with this assessment. Luckily, two of them are tech-savvy teenagers who take pity on me when they see I'm bamboozled.