Change in backup philosophy - Mac related

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  • Dave2002
    Full Member
    • Dec 2010
    • 18009

    #46
    I just noticed this NAS on Amazon - http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B...A3P5ROKL5A1OLE which might be on offer today (7th January) for under £150. I've no idea whether it would satisfy a requirement for backup storage, but it may. The software manual is quite interesting - http://www.downloads.netgear.com/fil..._23Dec2015.pdf

    Around pages 23-24 there are details of the various RAID modes, and perhaps Netgear specific modes. In the X-RAID mode the total storage capacity assuming similar drives, is one less than the total number of drives - so effectively with this 2 drive unit, the total capacity available with 2 installed drives is equivalent to a single drive without RAID protection. Other RAID modes may give different trade offs between protection levels and available capacity.

    Page 24 elaborates further. RAID 1 provides protection if one disk fails. RAID 5 provides protection if one disk fails, but requires a NAS with at least 4 drive bays - so the 2 drive unit here wouldn't work with RAID 5. RAID 6 provides protection if two disks fail, but also requires a NAS with at least 4 drive bays. RAID 50 requires a unit with at least 6 drives, and the total capacity available is 2 less than the number of drives installed. RAID 60 also requires a unit with at least 6 drives, but the total capacity available is 4 less than the number of drives installed. Thus for RAID 60 with a 10 drive unit [maybe a 12 drive unit, with 10 drives installed], the effective capacity would be 60%. A 12 drive unit populated with 10 x 1 Tbyte drives would have an effective capacity of 6 Tbytes in RAID 60 mode. 10 x 1 Tbyte drives would cost about £500 - http://www.amazon.co.uk/Red-3-5-inch...words=ReadyNAS

    I didn't realise before looking at the manual that the drives are formatted according to a RAID/NAS specific (Netgear?) format - which makes sense if you think that there has to be some infrastructure to support the RAID architecture. I'm not quite clear if the drive formatting would work with drives formatted for other manufacturer's RAID NAS systems.

    The particular NAS noted (2 drive unit) does not appear to have any wireless connections. I am not in fact sure if any NAS systems have this, so to use with mobile devices another network router or wireless access point would be needed on the networks. Most ethernet LAN networks will contain a wireless router nowadays, so that is probably not an issue.

    Does RAID operation reduce risk significantly? I don't know. The protection offered is against total data loss if one drive fails, or with more complex systems, two drives can fail. How likely is that, and how much does the risk reduce? A 12 bay NAS unit can cost more than £2000 and go up to £5-6000 - see http://www.dabs.com/search?q=ReadyNAS Drives to populate a large RAID NAS unit could also cost up to £1000 or even more.

    4 bay NAS devices seem to be around £2-400, while 6 bay ones seem to start around £600. The prices often don't include the cost of the drives, either. Some businesses could find RAID operation useful, but for domestic use the costs are probably too high to justify the possible levels of protection. Besides data protection, there might also be a performance improvement, though how significant that would be I can't say.

    Obviously all this extra "protection" could be rendered useless if someone drops a brick on the NAS unit, or it is stolen, or is damaged by fire or water. Which other manufacturers supply RAID systems which might work within a domestic network? Possibly such systems are pointless for domestic use because of cost, and also taking into account likely (or unlikely) failures. The first step is surely to quantify the value of the data - either "real", or "how much is it worth to you?", and also the degree of risk before embarking on a potentially very expensive storage solution for risks which may be avoidable in other ways.

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    • Anastasius
      Full Member
      • Mar 2015
      • 1842

      #47
      Not quite going according to plan as the MacBook Pro is erratic in waking up from sleep (using Wake On Ethernet access)....despite Energy Saver being told to never put it to sleep. Will try a Scheduled wake-up on the MacBook. Googling seems to suggest that this has/continues to be an ongoing issue with no known obvious cause or solution.
      Fewer Smart things. More smart people.

      Comment

      • Dave2002
        Full Member
        • Dec 2010
        • 18009

        #48
        Good luck with the MBP.

        I know you don't fully agree, but I do think that a notebook and a pen/biro helps sometimes to keep track of backups and files - at least to know where things have been stored. I am now seriously investing in labels to put on drives and sticks so I know which machines they go with, what backup software (SD!, CCC, TM) they work with etc. Does save time plugging them in to find out what's on each one.

        What I now want to know is if Time Machine can sensibly back up external devices connected to an iMac - as well as the main internal drive. Some web pages suggest this is possible, though only for one external device at a time. External devices appear on a backup exclusion list, and it seems that in order for them to be backed up they have to be unset/removed from the list.I don't really see why this should be restricted to just one external drive. One of the drives in the exclusion list will be the TM drive - quite what happens if that is removed from the list I don't want to think about. One could get a recursive mess - though on the other hand if there are other files on the drive then TM might do something a bit more sensible.

        If external drives are backed up by TM, then how do they appear in TM once backed up? I suppose if I look for yet another spare drive I could experiment, but somebody may have already tried this. Some of my "drives" are simply USB sticks or memory cards, though some go up to 128 Gbytes.

        Comment

        • Anastasius
          Full Member
          • Mar 2015
          • 1842

          #49
          You do like living dangerously, don't you! Time Machine is rubbish as a backup device. Why on earth would you want to use it when there are far better programs like SuperDuper and CCC available. They work. Time Machine is too flakey.
          Fewer Smart things. More smart people.

          Comment

          • Lordgeous
            Full Member
            • Dec 2012
            • 830

            #50
            x2!

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            • Dave2002
              Full Member
              • Dec 2010
              • 18009

              #51
              Originally posted by Lordgeous View Post
              x2!
              Ok, but don't worry too much. I take a fair number of copies, different programs, multiple drives.

              Comment

              • Anastasius
                Full Member
                • Mar 2015
                • 1842

                #52
                All sorted. Leaving the lid open stops it going to sleep when I ask it not to. Shutting the lid apparently overrides everything.
                Fewer Smart things. More smart people.

                Comment

                • muzzer
                  Full Member
                  • Nov 2013
                  • 1190

                  #53
                  2 questions - 1. Am looking to get a WD 3tb mycloud to copy all my itunes onto so I can stream thru a Sonos. I've got other WD NAS (see next q) so am familiar more or less with the ups and downs - am interested in hearing of any horror stories or alternative NAS recommendations. I have a Macbook. 2. My WD 3tb NAS has 'bricked' following a failed firmware update. LED stuck on yellow, not showing anywhere on network. I suspect the only option is sending it off to proper techie to get it unbricked and the data transferred - any recommendations extremely welcome. Thank you.

                  Comment

                  • Anastasius
                    Full Member
                    • Mar 2015
                    • 1842

                    #54
                    Originally posted by muzzer View Post
                    2 questions - 1. Am looking to get a WD 3tb mycloud to copy all my itunes onto so I can stream thru a Sonos. I've got other WD NAS (see next q) so am familiar more or less with the ups and downs - am interested in hearing of any horror stories or alternative NAS recommendations. I have a Macbook. 2. My WD 3tb NAS has 'bricked' following a failed firmware update. LED stuck on yellow, not showing anywhere on network. I suspect the only option is sending it off to proper techie to get it unbricked and the data transferred - any recommendations extremely welcome. Thank you.
                    I can't really help you, I'm afraid. I tried the WD MyCloud and it didn't do what I wanted it to do and so I returned it. I did briefly look into NAS but as I was specifically looking for remote backups, NAS's didn't enter the frame and/or work in Appleland that easily as far as I could see. I do seem to remember that there was an article 'Best of OSX NAS' but can't recall exactly where.
                    Fewer Smart things. More smart people.

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