Macs are not immune

[Dave2002]

I just thought I'd point out that Macs are not immune

http://uk.pcmag.com/software/13724/guide/12-antivirus-apps-for-the-mac

http://www.macworld.co.uk/feature/mac-software/mac-antivirus-internet-security-software-malware-review-3523842/

As far as malware is concerned, the Mac OS hasn't been the disaster which Windows environments gradually became, but that no longer seems to be a reason for complacency.

[Anastasius]

I beg to differ, Dave2002. Most of these vendors sell on fear. Just exactly what viruses etc are they going to guard against? Answer....none. There is nothing out there in the wild that is going to affect an up-to-date Mac. And just how are these anti-virus packages going to work if they have no virus to detect against? Most problems come from social-engineering ie spoof emails etc and scams and there is no AV software that can guard against user stupidity.

The latest 'scare' came out a few months ago ...a sort of 'man-in-the-middle' attack IIRC... but the circumstances needed to get infected were very tortuous indeed and the set-up had to be 'just so'.

The only caution, I guess, is that there will be no further security updates from Apple for Snow Leopard which is a shame as, IMO, SL is the best version of OSX. Later versions were retrograde IMO and added bloatware and support for iOS that many don't need. Apple annoyingly removed many minor features from the user-interface.

[MrGongGong]

Mackeeper (NO I don't have it)

[kernelbogey]

[...] The only caution, I guess, is that there will be no further security updates from Apple for Snow Leopard which is a shame as, IMO, SL is the best version of OSX. Later versions were retrograde IMO and added bloatware and support for iOS that many don't need. Apple annoyingly removed many minor features from the user-interface.

I'm running OSX 10.6.8 on a 7-year old MacBook, and have been thinking (for quite a long time!) about getting a new machine.

So, in view of your comment, wondering whether a used machine with Snow Leopard would be a better bet.

Any thoughts, Anastasius?

BW, kb

[Anastasius]

I guess the first question, kb, is why you want to get a new machine? Is it unreliable/broken?

OK..this is my take but others may have different views.

Snow Leopard

Pros

Some would argue the most stable, fastest version of OSX
Many legacy programs only run on SL (If you have a large enough hard drive you can get around this by splitting the drive into separate partitions eg one with SL, another with, say, Mavericks. You then boot up into whichever OS you need at the time.

I like the user interface. In Mavericks and Yosemite they have made a lot of the graphics very flat IMO. For example, I find it impossible to distinguish whether the icon for Back in Safari is valid or not (ie is it a single tab that was created by clicking on a link from another page and so there is no 'back' to go to, if you follow). The little spinning ball that tells you Mail is going off to see if there is any new mail. The red close window button having a small black dot in it to tell you that it needs saving. I find it impossible with Mavericks to tell if a program is running or not. Simply not enough contrast in the Dock. Mavericks user interface is all washed out IMO.

iTunes...if you use it and like version 10 then later versions of the OS force you to upgrade to v 11 or v 12 (which many people do not like, myself included). It is possible (but with a lot of faffing about) to run v10 but others report that other things then 'break' - like the App store.

Which brings me neatly round to Apps and all things iOS. If you don't have any i devices then read no further. But if you do then you can easily get out of sync and/or find that the version of your iOS requires the latest version of iTunes, for example. In fact it was this that forced my hand to upgrade to Mavericks as I had inadvertently let my iPod Touch update its iOS version and suddenly I could no longer communicate with it unless I Maverick'ed.

Cons

No further Security Updates from Apple.

Mavericks and Yosemite (particularly the latter) seem to have gone all iOS. If you have iPhones etc then I can see the benefit of Mavericks and Yosemite but if not then SL for me every time.

If you do get a new 'old' machine then make sure you can run SL on it if that is your wish.

Hope this helps. Any questions just ask.

I know that MrGG is an accomplished Mac user and may have other thoughts.

[MrGongGong]

I bought a refurbished Macbook pro, 1TB SSD, 15" last month (the last version with a DVD drive) which is working perfectly having had a totally clean install and cost the same as a much lower spec machine
There are some reputable folks about (PM me if you need a link) as well as buying from Apple.
The problem with Apple these days is (as i've ranted about before ) that the walk in service you used to get has gone with most of their energy concentrated on selling iPAds and phones

Mavericks was a disaster for me (and many others doing audio/video) but the Yosemite machine is running very well.

It's never a good idea to buy the latest anyway.
My Snow leopard machine works fine and i'm not sure that the lack of 'updates' is a problem as most of the software I run will be updated periodically anyway.

Macmail never worked well anyhow so Thunderbird is free and stable

[Anastasius]

I agree with you re reputable folks. I bought an old Macbook from macbankhome on eBay and very pleased with it. It's running Lion and I'm happy with that. It's for use away from home.

Interesting you had problems with Mail as I have to say mine has been trouble-free.

[Dave2002]

Mackeeper (NO I don't have it)

Don't touch that one!

[Dave2002]

I beg to differ, Dave2002. Most of these vendors sell on fear. Just exactly what viruses etc are they going to guard against? Answer....none. There is nothing out there in the wild that is going to affect an up-to-date Mac. And just how are these anti-virus packages going to work if they have no virus to detect against? Most problems come from social-engineering ie spoof emails etc and scams and there is no AV software that can guard against user stupidity.

I ageee about selling on fear, though there's not much selling in the Mac arena right now. I'm not going to go into too many details, but I think there are some malware packages which can get onto Macs. Maybe they "only" affect browsers, but they can be a darn nuisance.

I would assert that you are in fact incorrect in assuming that Macs can't get problems, though you are right that problems are hopefully much less likely than some of those that other rival OSs attract.

One concern is whether the companies that provide and suggest anti-virus software are in fact fuelling a fire. If you never experience any problems then maybe best to keep away from such anti-virus software, but if unusual things start to happen, then maybe some are worth checking out.

Part of my recent interest stems from an interest in backups, where I read that at least one backup system will stop as soon as it detects a file which will be flagged as malware by a fairly well known anti-virus package. There are some consequences if that indeed is what happens.

I'm not trying to be alarmist, but I think you are naive if you think Macs can never be "infected".

[Anastasius]

..... interest in backups, where I read that at least one backup system will stop as soon as it detects a file which will be flagged as malware by a fairly well known anti-virus package. There are some consequences if that indeed is what happens.

That were me. But I got round it by asking Sophos to automatically clean up threats. Problem solved. Having said that I currently have Sophos uninstalled as I was/am having trouble accessing a particular website with my IP address and one possible reason was a 'funny' with Sophos and so I removed it. Just not got back to re-installing it. Probably won't bother TBH.

I'm not trying to be alarmist, but I think you are naive if you think Macs can never be "infected".

I don't think that I said that. But I think you're more likely to fall foul of a phishing attack or a scam if anyone does not use the wetware between their ears !!

[Dave2002]

That were me. But I got round it by asking Sophos to automatically clean up threats. Problem solved. Having said that I currently have Sophos uninstalled as I was/am having trouble accessing a particular website with my IP address and one possible reason was a 'funny' with Sophos and so I removed it. Just not got back to re-installing it. Probably won't bother TBH.

Ah - so we've been treading over similar ground. We here have several machines. We had one anomaly in which some pdf files did not display properly on mrs d's Macbook Air (she calls it an airbook), and we discovered that the problem disappeared if Sophos was uninstalled. That particular problem was not replcated on my MBP, but we have found differences which presumably are due to hardware discrepancies. Awareness and vigiilance are helpful, just in case, and tools such as Sophos do seem helpful on occasions.

I tend to get suspicious if things go very slow, or if MBPs get hot, or if some programs (e.g Spotify) always start up after booting - even if the preferences are set up so that they shouldn't. I'm usually happy to bin any program which looks as though it might be going wild.

[kernelbogey]

I guess the first question, kb, is why you want to get a new machine? Is it unreliable/broken?

The answer to this is that I believe/assume that a seven year old machine is getting towards the end of its life. I had a catastrophic hard disc failure a year back and the 'geniuses' at the Southampton Apple shop - and I mean no disrespect - couldn't fix it. But I found a man who could and did. I had been lazy/naive about backing up and all my photos for the last seven years were on that hard disc . I'm now backing up with Time Machine.

So, returning to Anastasius's question, I think it's time to upgrade to a more modern, lighter MacBook and keep this one at home for internet music etc.

I'm very interested by this thread and will make time to study properly some of the suggestions.

I hope to return. Thanks for asking, Anastasius.
BW, kb

[MrGongGong]

I had a catastrophic hard disc failure a year back and the 'geniuses' at the Southampton Apple shop - and I mean no disrespect - couldn't fix it.

Fitting a new hard disc in a macbook takes me about 20 minutes, 12 of which are taken up with looking for the right screwdrivers and my reading glasses so I can see the screws that hold the bottom cover on.

If this really is the case then don't ever go there again.

If your photos are really precious you should be able to pay for recovery BUT its very expensive (last time I thought about it for a dead HD with a composition on it would have been about £20 per Gig).

If you do have precious things on your computers then don't trust Time Machine IMV

[french frank]

Fitting a new hard disc in a macbook takes me about 20 minutes, 12 of which are taken up with looking for the right screwdrivers and my reading glasses so I can see the screws that hold the bottom cover on.

But fitting a new disc isn't the same as 'rescuing' an old disc!

If you do have precious things on your computers then don't trust Time Machine IMV

Time Machine isn't - as far as I understand it - intended to be a plain back-up. I use SuperDuper! with SmartUpdate. I only use Time Machine for locating stuff that I've accidentally deleted (or deleted on purpose and then wish I hadn't).

[MrGongGong]

But fitting a new disc isn't the same as 'rescuing' an old disc!
.

Indeed
I wouldn't expect the 'geniuses' (that's a word that looks wrong) to be able to do data recovery
the obvious solution would be to fit a new HD and copy the cloned version onto that but............

Backup Backup Backup