Proms 2014

[Flosshilde]

As I thought, 'Muzak' is (or was) the name of the company providing the stuff. My query was just an asside really, but thanks for confirming it Mr GG

[teamsaint]

Now I'm really confused. Not only do I not get the 'music/muzak/noise/sounds demarcations, but now there are questions as to whether things have been 'composed' or 'performed', or not, as the case may be!





.

I have googled the "Plink Plank Plonk" schools, (1 and 2) and cannot find them.

perhaps they are under Muzak. or under water.

oh, and if anybody feels cross about this stuff, I suggest they ring Orange "customer services" with a network problem , to bring some perspective.....

[french frank]

Enlighten me tomorrow maybe?

Well, what I had in mind (it wasn't a gratuitous comment) was that in your Msg #30, your assumptions (as I understood them) were:

1. a) that there would have been a large enough number of regular Proms attenders at the concert (and R3 listeners listening) to need to have the urban music personally 'contextualised' for them

b) that placing three and a half minutes of classical music at the beginning of each half would be some sort of preparation for the urban music concert that was to follow

2. a) that cutting the short pieces of classical music from the TV broadcast was because they were thought to have been 'off-putting' to the BBC Three audience. That is where it simply became an urban music gig with a big backing group; and I would disagree that the Proms are just a showcase for any kind of music played by an orchestra.

b) the concert was broadcast live on Radio 1 and Radio 1Xtra: why did they not think that putting in a small amount of classical music would have been 'off-putting' to those audiences?

A much braver Proms programmer would have alternated classical and urban music throughout the concert. If they wanted to televise an urban music gig with an orchestra, they had the BBC orchestra, they found a suitable conductor and, presumably, the necessary rehearsal time: they could have done it at any time without inserting it into the Proms season.

3. You are right: the BBC orchestras are not the "exclusive preserve" of the classical music audience: they are widely used for television work now; the Concert Orchestra is regarded as Radio 2's 'house band'.

That aside, perhaps I was naive in thinking that current Proms strategy did aim to introduce new audiences to classical music, not merely to familiarise it with the RAH and where its cafés and lavatories are.

[Beef Oven!]

I have googled the "Plink Plank Plonk" schools, (1 and 2) and cannot find them.

perhaps they are under Muzak. or under water.

Try googling under 'Clangers'

[teamsaint]

Try googling under 'Clangers'

Now you're talking.

[Honoured Guest]

A much braver Proms programmer would have alternated classical and urban music throughout the concert. If they wanted to televise an urban music gig with an orchestra, they had the BBC orchestra, they found a suitable conductor and, presumably, the necessary rehearsal time: they could have done it at any time without inserting it into the Proms season.

3. You are right: the BBC orchestras are not the "exclusive preserve" of the classical music audience: they are widely used for television work now; the Concert Orchestra is regarded as Radio 2's 'house band'.

That aside, perhaps I was naive in thinking that current Proms strategy did aim to introduce new audiences to classical music, not merely to familiarise it with the RAH and where its cafés and lavatories are.

Obviously, not every Prom is planned to introduce new audiences to classical music. I agree that this same Urban Classic Prom could have been put on outside the Proms but I still think that it achieved greater attention by its inclusion in the Proms season and I still think that the Proms should best present the full range of orchestral activity. I think it would be bonkers to contaminate all non-classical music presented in the Proms by surrounding it with classical music. Why would you do that???

[Eine Alpensinfonie]

"contaminate"...?

[cloughie]

Obviously, not every Prom is planned to introduce new audiences to classical music. I agree that this same Urban Classic Prom could have been put on outside the Proms but I still think that it achieved greater attention by its inclusion in the Proms season and I still think that the Proms should best present the full range of orchestral activity. I think it would be bonkers to contaminate all non-classical music presented in the Proms by surrounding it with classical music. Why would you do that???

What an interesting choice of word - as though all music has to compartmentalised. Heaven forbid that there should be the need to quarantine rap music for fear that it may be infected by exposure to the music of a dead composer - Roll over Beethoven and rattle John's Cage!

[french frank]

I think it would be bonkers to contaminate all non-classical music presented in the Proms by surrounding it with classical music. Why would you do that???

That's not what I suggested. The BBC's own description of the Proms is "the world's greatest classical music festival". Far more important, surely, to bring new audiences to classical music at the Proms than to 'present the full range of orchestral activity'. I merely say that, to give an example from a few years ago, 'An Evening with Michael Ball' simply brings Michael Ball fans to the RAH during the Proms season. Just as the attraction of a Doctor Who concert is, principally, Doctor Who. These could be money spinners for the BBC at any time. I feel "the world's greatest classical music festival" should be more ambitious in expanding the audience for, what the BBC would probably term, its 'core proposition'.

This is why I don't feel every concert should be Mahler symphonies or contemporary music. There needs to be a gradation in the programmes, signalled by the marketing. Building new audiences for classical music is a challenging - and exciting - undertaking. I'm not certain that current strategies are very effective.

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

"contaminate"...?

Another Dr Who Prom?

[Eine Alpensinfonie]

Quite so, Ferney.

[EdgeleyRob]

A lot of good music and musicians have nothing to 'say' and have been saying it loud and long.

And so much good music,with or without something to say,not given the opportunity to say it!

[EnemyoftheStoat]

Building new audiences for classical music is a challenging - and exciting - undertaking. I'm not certain that current strategies are very effective.

I'm afraid that RW is specifically interested in building new audiences for the Proms (not classical music in general) so he can keep his percentages increasing. Note audiences plural; the one that turns up for Hollywood or 6Music will not be the one that comes out for core classical.

[french frank]

I'm afraid that RW is specifically interested in building new audiences for the Proms (not classical music in general) so he can keep his percentages increasing.

And don't forget the high-profile publicity and approving purrs from the press people who aren't hugely attracted by classical music anyway. Gotta be worth a performance bonus.

[Nick Armstrong]

Where's that thread in which bluestateprommer and others come up with some info about concerts and dates in the Proms 2014 season???