More Conservative Vision an Innovation....

[Beef Oven!]

All the more reason, then, why you might have been expected to be capable of rather greater visionary success in the arboretum than some, but it seems not...

Don't get confused ahinton, I can see right through the arboretum. What you can't get your brain around, is that I don't agree with you et al.

[eighthobstruction]

I know full well about the scenario you describe as I routinely assist someone precisely in that sort of position.

Was it the ghost of Christmas past that moved you....??

[Beef Oven!]

Was it the ghost of Christmas past that moved you....??

What do you mean?

[eighthobstruction]

Didn't you have a different reply 5 minutes ago....T'was only a joke not a stab to the heart....Dickens: Xmas Carol....

[ahinton]

Don't get confused ahinton,

In spite of some of what you write, I don't, so don't worry about that!

I can see right through the arboretum.

Ah, so far from merely being unable to see the wood for the trees, you can't even see the trees themselves!

What you can't get your brain around, is that I don't agree with you et al.

What makes you think that I cannot see that?! Anyway, since you have a habit of addressing me on occasion as "Al", are you suggesting that you don't agree with either half of the split persona that you wrongly seem to assume me to possess?

[Beef Oven!]

Didn't you have a different reply 5 minutes ago....T'was only a joke not a stab to the heart....Dickens: Xmas Carol....

No, what do you mean? I suppose you think that I might have posted something that my friend would see and be pissed off with me. Well that's not true. I didn't post anything like that and I therefore didn't need to change it, so I didn't.

[eighthobstruction]

Now I really don't understand....

[Beef Oven!]

Now I really don't understand....

It's simple, in group 1 you have the genuine claimants, in group two.......never mind.

[eighthobstruction]

good <phew>

[amateur51]

No, they are not benefits claimants. They exercise their right to go with their conscience. Some members of my family are like this. Silly, but it's up to them I suppose.

They're potential benefit claimants who are bullied away from claiming by the Daily Mail et al's use of the word scroungers.

This is not a new phenomenon - lots of poor people have denied themselves access to 'charity' because of the attitudes of others.

[teamsaint]

this argument /discussion illustrates the point all too well that benefit fraud, though real and important, is used as a smokesceen by those who wish to avoid taking action elsewhere.

http://www.cas.org.uk/features/myth-busting-real-figures-benefit-fraud

[ahinton]

this argument /discussion illustrates the point all too well that benefit fraud, though real and important, is used as a smokesceen by those who wish to avoid taking action elsewhere.

http://www.cas.org.uk/features/myth-...-benefit-fraud

Indeed - and many thanks for posting this. The headline article (as distinct from the other official links) is not from the same source as the figures that Richard Barrett cited some time ago but it makes the same very important point and puts matters into a sensible perspective.

[amateur51]

this argument /discussion illustrates the point all too well that benefit fraud, though real and important, is used as a smokesceen by those who wish to avoid taking action elsewhere.

http://www.cas.org.uk/features/myth-...-benefit-fraud

Great post teams, from an agency that knows.

[Beef Oven!]

They're potential benefit claimants who are bullied away from claiming by the Daily Mail et al's use of the word scroungers.

This is not a new phenomenon - lots of poor people have denied themselves access to 'charity' because of the attitudes of others.

The whole population is a potential claimant.

Bullied away by the Daily Mail? This is an hysterical viewpoint!

People not wanting to sign on etc is indeed nothing new; a marginal phenomenon albeit.

[Beef Oven!]

this argument /discussion illustrates the point all too well that benefit fraud, though real and important, is used as a smokesceen by those who wish to avoid taking action elsewhere.

http://www.cas.org.uk/features/myth-...-benefit-fraud

No ts, it's not a smokescreen for anything. All fraud and tax evasion etc is wrong.