Women bishops in Wales

[An_Inspector_Calls]

I didn't say anything else was offensive: I said, exactly: 'I would refer you (if I may) to the implications of his Msg #46 and his insulting reference to "Welsh Wimmin" [sic]. If you can discern no 'implications', perhaps we could develop the discussion further? '

So what did you mean by 'But my main point was the rest of your post [#46], not that particular spelling.' in [#81]. It seems you're objecting not just to 'wimmin' but something else as well.

And later 'all in their 60s or not far off'. That sounds ageist to me.

[scottycelt]

The case of wimmin is different from those others - it really was first used in the 1970s by feminists avoiding the men in women. It wasn't so much that they wanted to insult men, as scotty thinks, so much as dissociate themselves from them.

Then it was picked up by the misogynistic men who wanted to jeer at feminists (Private Eye's 'Wimmin' column doesn't appear any more, I'm glad to say).

Apart from apparently knowing more about what scotty thinks than even scotty himself that post is admirably fair-minded and mercifully free of some of the illogicalities and inconsistencies elsewhere. Whether women 'disassociating' themselves from men is 'insulting' or not it is clearly very stupid. Women and men are interdependent. They are undeniably different but each cannot possibly exist without the other, if only when we contemplate the gift of life itself. That much is pretty clear to most women and men, I suspect.

Now here's one of my actual "thoughts". Should Feminism (& Political Correctness) be permitted to be any more of a Sacred Cow than Religion? Why should one and their adherents be regularly pilloried here (with little or no talk of 'insult') and the other(s) considered well-nigh untouchable? Maybe the subject of a separate thread? No, on second thoughts, let's not "go there" ... it wouldn't be very wise, would it?

I had thought that the feminists invented the spelling, but the OED tells me it was used in the C18:.

Excellent, Jean. Now that the value of dictionaries has suddenly been re-discovered we might get to the truth of the matter! However, whatever the truth of the matter, I'll be extremely careful never to use that particular spelling again, at least on this forum.

We can all rest assured of that!

[french frank]

Now here's one of my actual "thoughts". Should Feminism (& Political Correctness) be permitted to be any more of a Sacred Cow than Religion? Why should one and their adherents be regularly pilloried here (with little or no talk of 'insult') and the other(s) considered well-nigh untouchable? Maybe the subject of a separate thread? No, on second thoughts, let's not "go there" ... it wouldn't be very wise, would it?

I agree 100% with that, Scotty. I think there are double standards in the matter of 'tolerance': "I don't have to tolerate what you think because it's rubbish/a fraud/not what I think."

[jean]

...Now that the value of dictionaries has suddenly been re-discovered...

As far as I'm concerned it's never been in dispute. But that value lies in telling us how a word has been used in the past rather than how it must be used henceforth and even for evermore.

I do my best not to 'pillory' religion, but insofar as it bases its tenets on ridiculous passages of Leviticus, I give myself permission to allow it to pillory itself.

[french frank]

As far as I'm concerned it's never been in dispute. But that value lies in telling us how a word has been used in the past rather than how it must be used henceforth and even for evermore.

I do my best not to 'pillory' religion, but insofar as it bases its tenets on ridiculous passages of Leviticus, I give myself permission to allow it to pillory itself.

There is something of a connection between those two points, isn't there?

The examples of early spellings of 'wimmin' in the dictionary seem clearly to be historical ignorant/dialectal spellings rather than ones chosen in preference to the standard form in order to make some sort of point (as the later examples are). The fact that it is in the dictionary as an historically attested usage (that's what the OED is about) doesn't indicate that it is 'appropriate' for the 21st century, any more than spelling Purcell as Pursill would be. I shall not pursue the analogy as regards your second statement ...

[amateur51]

So what did you mean by 'But my main point was the rest of your post [#46], not that particular spelling.' in [#81]. It seems you're objecting not just to 'wimmin' but something else as well.

And later 'all in their 60s or not far off'. That sounds ageist to me.

I'm very happy being in my 60s, thank you.

[jean]

I would be if only I still were...

[french frank]

So what did you mean by 'But my main point was the rest of your post [#46], not that particular spelling.' in [#81]. It seems you're objecting not just to 'wimmin' but something else as well.

No, it doesn't. You queried something Jean said, I was saying the 'implications' of what scotty said suggested (at least to me) that she was correct. And I invited you to study the 'implications' - to see what you thought. It wasn't an 'objection', it was merely a response to something you said.

And later 'all in their 60s or not far off'. That sounds ageist to me.

It doesn't to me: Scotty raised a question about something I had said on another thread: how could I accuse him/anyone of being misogynistic when I had brought up the subject of gender (in fact, he had suggested this first by saying Margaret Hodge was an 'inappropriate', frequently OTT, PAC chair who reminded him of a former teacher who sounded a bit of a martinet) but my point had been (on this other thread) about the gender, background and age of the Trust members. That was relevant to show that the chair of the PAC would have little in common, Hodge being female, of (I believe) Jewish émigré extraction, a Labour MP educated at LSE. She has, on the other hand, just passed her 69th birthday which may or may not endow her with a fellow feeling towards them (bus passes, and so on). The point I was making was that there was little likeliness of feelings of 'clubbiness' with those she was questioning which might have led to a softening of her (characteristically) abrasive - or inappropriate and OTT in Scotty's words - approach.

But this is moving into the topic of another thread.

[An_Inspector_Calls]

Whatever you say . . .

[french frank]

Whatever you say . . .

Getting back on topic - would you have any particular feelings about the next bishop in your diocese being a woman?

[zoomy]

2. They menstruate.

[/i]

Exactly, Jean but ...oh gosh, doesn't it just show how primitive and vicious these semitic religions really are.

[eighthobstruction]

Just so Am51 cannot be blamed as passive-aggressive -I will post this ....http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-norther...-west-24171855

[amateur51]

Just so Am51 cannot be blamed as passive-aggressive -I will post this ....http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-norther...-west-24171855

Many thanks, eighth - three cheers for Bishop Pat, I say.

[Padraig]

Many thanks, eighth - three cheers for Bishop Pat, I say.

I think Bishop Padraigin Storey will be a spendid addition to the CoI.
St.Augustine's is in Derry, you know, but I have to confess! - I am not acquainted.
Hooray! Hooray! Hooray!

[amateur51]

I think Bishop Padraigin Storey will be a spendid addition to the CoI.
St.Augustine's is in Derry, you know, but I have to confess! - I am not acquainted.
Hooray! Hooray! Hooray!

Noting your use of Padraigin, Padraig - is the use of Bishop kosher here? :winkeye: