Gay interest: Discussion v campaigning

[Pabmusic]

Very droll indeed! - but take care; it mnight incite scottykilt to tell you to put something in that well photographed pipe in your own avatar and smoke it!...

Oh dear. Oh dear. Or it might just be advice on where to put the pipe. Oh dear.

[ahinton]

Oh dear. Oh dear. Or it might just be advice on where to put the pipe. Oh dear.

Oh dear indeed - not least because a Scottish piper might reasonably be expected to be especially well qualified to offer such advice...

[french frank]

You also allege that "children have (had to) to suffer" on account of the closure of those agencies

But they have had to suffer in that they would have to be placed with adoption agencies, rather than Catholic adoption agencies. I imagine the majority of children for adoption have to suffer in this way too.

Happily, it seems that few will suffer as the threatened agencies have been quietly buckling to and accepting that the law is the law.

"It's not that Catholics aren't interested in this any more," said Bishop Conry. "But we're not going to have a public fight that we're possibly going to lose and come out of it with everyone suffering."

This seems to have been more generally accepted - that the future well-being of the children is really what matters. Very Christian.

[ahinton]

But they have had to suffer in that they would have to be placed with adoption agencies, rather than Catholic adoption agencies. I imagine the majority of children for adoption have to suffer in this way too..

Unles this is a little more of that irony being mentioned earlier, I don't quite understand this...

[french frank]

Unles this is a little more of that irony being mentioned earlier, I don't quite understand this...

Then read the rest of the post.

[ahinton]

Then read the rest of the post.

I did read it; what I didn't do and should have done, however - but have now done - is read the article to which you linked, so all makes more sense now; thanks.

[scottycelt]

But they have had to suffer in that they would have to be placed with adoption agencies, rather than Catholic adoption agencies. I imagine the majority of children for adoption have to suffer in this way too.

Happily, it seems that few will suffer as the threatened agencies have been quietly buckling to and accepting that the law is the law.

"It's not that Catholics aren't interested in this any more," said Bishop Conry. "But we're not going to have a public fight that we're possibly going to lose and come out of it with everyone suffering."

This seems to have been more generally accepted - that the future well-being of the children is really what matters. Very Christian.

And of course the law was changed from what it had been previously. Exactly the same is happening in the other direction in Russia.

So maybe gays and others in this country might consider accepting simple reality and quietly 'buckle to' as to what is happening with the change of law in Russia, never mind the directly-affected Russian gays themselves? After all they are only a small minority like Catholics in the UK. They must accept the will of majority opinion and simply lump it, eh?

What is sauce for the g....

[french frank]

And of course the law was changed from what it had been previously. Exactly the same is happening in the other direction in Russia.

So maybe gays and others in this country might consider accepting simple reality and quietly 'buckle to' as to what is happening with the change of law in Russia, never mind the directly-affected Russian gays themselves? After all they are only a small minority like Catholics in the UK. They must accept the will of majority opinion and simply lump it, eh?

What is sauce for the g....

"God, grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change,
The courage to change the things I can,
And wisdom to know the difference."

That seems exacly what the the Catholics in the link I gave you are doing. Religion's supreme purpose, it seems to me, is to increase the good in the world, and not to increase the misery.

[scottycelt]

"God, grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change,
The courage to change the things I can,
And wisdom to know the difference."

That seems exacly what the the Catholics in the link I gave you are doing. Religion's supreme purpose, it seems to me, is to increase the good in the world, and not to increase the misery.

Thanks for the sermonly reminder, french frank ... much appreciated. :winkeye: The obvious flaw in your last sentence is that your idea of 'good' and 'misery' might be quite different from another person's.

However, I'm sure you'll at least accept that the wise words that you quote are pretty sound advice for everyone whether 'secular gay' in Russia or 'straight Catholic' in the UK?

Indeed, if you read it again, you will see it is specifically and entirely aimed at the "self" and nobody or nothing else!

[french frank]

As you said in your previous post:

And of course the law was changed from what it had been previously.

So things can be changed - with courage!

[Barbirollians]

And of course the law was changed from what it had been previously. Exactly the same is happening in the other direction in Russia.

So maybe gays and others in this country might consider accepting simple reality and quietly 'buckle to' as to what is happening with the change of law in Russia, never mind the directly-affected Russian gays themselves? After all they are only a small minority like Catholics in the UK. They must accept the will of majority opinion and simply lump it, eh?


What is sauce for the g....

So if the law on the emancipation of Catholics was reversed you would accept that quietly ?

[scottycelt]

So if the law on the emancipation of Catholics was reversed you would accept that quietly ?

As it happens, there is still not full emancipation of Catholics but I guess, in practice, not many have any great ambitions to be King or Queen or the Lord Chancellor or Whatever. I do also remember the rather sneering tone in some quarters, including much of the UK media, when Tony Blair converted to Catholicism. He rather sensibly decided to wait until after he was PM or he might have had the Wrath of Amsey 'n' Flossie descend upon him. He no doubt got that anyway! And never once did I see the hapless Tone being described as 'brave and courageous' for finally 'coming out' over his religious beliefs.

Finally, Catholics have nothing to be so 'proud' about that they take to the streets to express that pride. On the contrary, they are much more likely to shake their heads in despair and feel a deep sense of shame, and as french frank so memorably put it 'hide for cover' (or words to that effect!) :smile:

Oh and I do miss the 'smileys' here as well ... in fact I feel sure I even came across french frank descending to the use of a smiley 'code' (with, unlike Mr Blair, notable conversion failure) but my eyes may well have been mistaken as ahinton will almost certainly now authoritatively confirm!

[Nick Armstrong]

That seems to be as glaring example as I've ever seen of totally sidestepping the question

You're right though: I'm missing the :laugh: smiley now!

[jean]

The Jesuits did their work well!

But I don't think it's quite correct to say

...Catholics have nothing to be so 'proud' about that they take to the streets to express that pride...

What are they doing here?

http://www.oxfordoratory.org.uk/images/news/1370250215.jpg

[Ferretfancy]

"God, grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change,
The courage to change the things I can,
And wisdom to know the difference."

That seems exacly what the the Catholics in the link I gave you are doing. Religion's supreme purpose, it seems to me, is to increase the good in the world, and not to increase the misery.

Judging by the millions of dead over the last few centuries, religion doesn't seem to be doing much of a job.