Pope Francis and Gay People

[Stillhomewardbound]

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For God's sake drop it! Live and let live and let others do the same. Resurrecting this topic can only harm these message boards.

HS

But I thought the whole point of setting up this thread was that hot political potatoes could be served up for prolonged discussion without disturbing the peace elsewhere on the boards.

Yes, I'm something of a gay militant (verbally, at least), but even I tire sometimes of the gay agenda being too prevalent in the media, but with what's going on in Russia there are still huge corners of the world where the the phrase 'live and let live' and is being horribly trodden underfoot.

The thread is very clearly titled. To those that are tired of this discussion I can only say it is entirely clear what the content is. It says so on the tin.

To those who really think this discussion is a complete bore please check out the following video and you will have the opportunity to see just how live this debate remains:

http://www.out.com/entertainment/popnography/2013/07/25/watch-harvey-fierstein-takes-putin-protest-live?fb_action_ids=10151565453951947&fb_action_types=og.likes&fb_ref=.UfZkjTV-Lqk.like&fb_source=aggregation&fb_aggregation_id=288381481237582

[Sydney Grew]

Pope Francis has said that . . . gay men can be priests.

That is a tremendous move forward! How glad I am to hear it! For they are indeed eminently suitable. And my gratitude goes out to Member Amateur as being the first to draw this real news to the attention of us all! Great changes are underway in our era one feels and the unthinking, petty and prejudiced laggards of this world will at last be swept aside and left gasping and impotent by the way-side.

I am about to watch Messiaen's great opera in the Holy Father's honour.

[ahinton]

That is a tremendous move forward! How glad I am to hear it! For they are indeed eminently suitable. And my gratitude goes out to Member Amateur as being the first to draw this real news to the attention of us all! Great changes are underway in our era one feels and the unthinking, petty and prejudiced laggards of this world will at last be swept aside and left gasping and impotent by the way-side.

I would not say that gay people are "eminently suitable" for the priesthood per se; what I would say is that there is not and has never been any reason obvious to me that they are any less suitale than their heterosexual counterparts, so I do agree with you that this is a welcome sttement; however, it will not only have to be backed up by the visible appointment of gay people to the priesthood (so that the Pope's statement does not turn out to be mere words said for effect), the situation in which homosexual acts are still deemed to be sinful will have surely to be duly reconsidered (otherwise an already existing anomaly will seem to have been broadened) and the question of women priests (both heterosexual and homosexual) will likewise need to come under the spotlight.

From the recent revelations in a now defunct Roman Catholic school in my country, there are other matters sexual to which the Church must continue to deal if it to progress in its general social credibility; perhaps the untimate establishment of a climate in which homosexual acts between consenting adults (including priests) are no longer frowned upon by a Church that will have become prepared to sanction the appointment of gay preists and women preists of either sexual inclination might help to ensure the due consignment of these grave past misdemeanours to history where they should belong.

But lest I appear churlish about this, yes, the Pope's statement is in itself wholly commendable and one can only hope that it is but one step on a reformist road.

[Mr Pee]

Or I. Is Mr Pee assuming that everyone who has opinions about equality for gay people is gay? There is no reason to assume that.

Don't be absurd. What on earth makes you suggest such a thing?

[Mr Pee]

The input of such as Mr Pee inclines me to I wonder if we shold be careful about discussing violas here too...

Not for the first time, I have no idea what you are on about; if you wish to start a thread about the viola, feel free. I have performed Mozart's lovely "Kegelstatt" Trio a few times over the years and of course participated in the usual musician's pastime of cracking jokes about the instrument.

[Sir Velo]

My own intention in saying that did relate, specifically, to gay marriage, not gay issues generally. I saw the headline on the news site and assumed there would be a new thread: I was quite reconciled to the fact. On the other hand, I don't regard it as 'homophobia' if some members get fed up with what (to them) might appear as a disproportionate amount of time and space devoted to gay issues. I got fed up with the endless procession of 'immigration' stories at one point, every time there was a story in the tabloid press.

Maybe the answer is to take a poll of members' views as to whether this thread should remain or not. That would be the most democratic way.

[Mr Pee]

Yes, I'm something of a gay militant (verbally, at least), but even I tire sometimes of the gay agenda being too prevalent in the media

And on these messageboards, entirely thanks to the repeated input of one or two members.

[Sydney Grew]

. . . That would be the most democratic way.

Sorry but that is not advisable! "Demo-cracy" = rule by the demos (the mob or rabble, to use Kant's translation).

[mercia]

amazing how quickly the news agenda moves on, it took me several clicks to find the "Pope story" online this morning

anyway, I was wondering what anyone thought about this (highly rated :smiley: ) comment under the BBC article

Pope Francis' style is chiefly pastoral. The views he expresses in the above article change not one jot of Church doctrine or teaching. He is inline with Benedict XVI and John Paul II. What's different is the style and the way of conveying the message in more inclusive language. This is a good thing but those who think this means a big doctrinal shift towards secular norms, will be disappointed.


[do I get into trouble for copying that verbatim ?]

[ahinton]

Not for the first time, I have no idea what you are on about; if you wish to start a thread about the viola, feel free. I have performed Mozart's lovely "Kegelstatt" Trio a few times over the years and of course participated in the usual musician's pastime of cracking jokes about the instrument.

Just think about it (or not, as the case may or may not be); in the meantime, please note that there is already such a thread so there's no need for me to start one.

Anyway - back to the topic!

[ahinton]

Sorry but that is not advisable! "Demo-cracy" = rule by the demos (the mob or rabble, to use Kant's translation).

So how do you think that this forum should be run, then?

[Sir Velo]

Sorry but that is not advisable! "Demo-cracy" = rule by the demos (the mob or rabble, to use Kant's translation).

Surely you're not suggesting that forum members are a "rabble" Sydney?

[Flosshilde]

I wonder if we shold be careful about discussing violas here too...

Why? They are lovely flowers - delicate appearance, but tough. Much to be preferred to those brash, vulgar pansies.

[jean]

amazing how quickly the news agenda moves on, it took me several clicks to find the "Pope story" online this morning

anyway, I was wondering what anyone thought about this (highly rated :smiley: ) comment under the BBC article

Pope Francis' style is chiefly pastoral. The views he expresses in the above article change not one jot of Church doctrine or teaching. He is inline with Benedict XVI and John Paul II. What's different is the style and the way of conveying the message in more inclusive language. This is a good thing but those who think this means a big doctrinal shift towards secular norms, will be disappointed.

There's an excellent comment on this on the website of the gay Catholic organisation Quest, which I'll post when I get my computer back (can't do much on this phone.)

[Mr Pee]

amazing how quickly the news agenda moves on

Talking of which, does anyone remember that Edward Snowden chappie? I seem to recall he was all over the papers not long ago. Now......barely a mention.