Privacy and the State

[amateur51]

There is a view held by some people that if you haven't got anything to hide, then you haven't anything to fear from all this surveillance.

In this article, Ian Brown explores the truth of this notion.an Brown is a senior research fellow at the Oxford Internet Institute, University of Oxford. His research is focused on public policy issues around information and the internet, particularly privacy and copyright.

Yes, NSA surveillance should worry the law-abiding

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2013/jun/10/nsa-snooping-law-abiding

[scottycelt]

You do realise that in Pakistan and Afghanistan some people regard the democratically elected governments of those countries as being responsible for the murder of hundreds of 'innnocent civilians', don't you? And as far these people in Pakistan and Afghanistan are concerned, the citizens of USA and UK are complicit in these killings because we elected these governments and so we have blood on our hands too.

It may be distasteful for you to acknowledge this, but that is what is driving this 'terrorism'. Snooping on them will not stop it; quitting Afghanistan, Pakistan and other Muslim lands may be a step in the right direction.

The Coalition involvement in Afghanistan was backed by UN authority. Are you now saying that an Afghanistan condemned to Taliban rule is preferable to the almost world-unaminous international rescue action sanctioned by the UN?

[amateur51]

The Coalition involvement in Afghanistan was backed by UN authority. Are you now saying that an Afghanistan condemned to Taliban rule is preferable to the almost world-unaminous international rescue action sanctioned by the UN?

Your sophistry will butter no parsnips for the aggrieved people in Afghanistan & Pakistan, scotty. Actions speak louder than words, remember?

[An_Inspector_Calls]

In any case, far from refuting the argument, A-I-C has merely disagreed with it - or expressed an opinion without evidence. If (pace Bryn) paranoia means 'a tendency towards excessive or irrational suspiciousness and distrustfulness', in order to claim that the views expressed were 'paranoia' it is necessary to prove that they are both excessive and irrational, whereas that is the point on which opinions differ.

Seeing 'conspiracy everywhere' is an inaccurate claim.

Quite: like most people in this thread I'm merely expressing my viewpoint (but on the way quoting from a dictionary listing for the word paranoia).

[An_Inspector_Calls]

That would rather depend on how many single innocent human lives were lost as a result, wouldn't it?

Let's get one thing straight. Why are the US and UK governments doing this? Is it because they genuinely care about the lives of the people they govern? If they did care surely a better policy would be to stop invading and threatening other countries, and thereby creating radicalised cadres who will strike back in any way they think they can? So obviously it isn't that.

Not invading or threatening is not a necessarily a better policy, it's simply another possible policy which may, or may not, care for the people they govern. They may or may not be following that policy for many reasons. But it does not prove that they seek (or otherwise) to monitor communications for other reasons than to care for their people.

However, your view is that they're monitoring us, or seeking to do so, as a weapon to counter any opposition to their campaign to impoverish the masses, and crucify the sick, disabled, and anyone north of Watford. Oh, and we're stuffed, because the opposition parties are of like mind.

Yeah, that'll be right!

[Mr Pee]

So I guess you don't have
a beard
a rucksack
an Irish accent
a disability
dark skin
a boyfriend
and so on...........

You're right, I have none of those things. And what that list has to do with the issue under discussion, I have absolutely no idea.

[MrGongGong]

You're right, I have none of those things. And what that list has to do with the issue under discussion, I have absolutely no idea.

"La la la , look at the trees , how green they are
now for a tune on the clarinet"

and so on

Do you not ever recall some people with some of those things being wrongly accused, arrested, imprisoned or even killed ?
but carry on "la la la la "

Nothing to hide
Nothing to fear

:yikes:

[Beef Oven]

"La la la , look at the trees , how green they are
now for a tune on the clarinet"

and so on

Do you not ever recall some people with some of those things being wrongly accused, arrested, imprisoned or even killed ?
but carry on "la la la la "

Nothing to hide
Nothing to fear

:yikes:

Yeah, right on bruv - Pee needs to get real..............

First they came for the Gaperon-lovers,
and I didn't speak out because I don't like cheese.

Then they came for the Harry Nilsson lookalikes,
and I didn't speak out because I don't look like Harry Nilsson.

Then they came for the conductors that didn't use a baton,
and I didn't speak out because I like batons.

Then they came for me,

and there was no one left to speak for me.

Watch out Pee, there's a real fascist state out there! :laugh:

[Serial_Apologist]

The Coalition involvement in Afghanistan was backed by UN authority. Are you now saying that an Afghanistan condemned to Taliban rule is preferable to the almost world-unaminous international rescue action sanctioned by the UN?

Then why are the governments behind the UN-sanctioned occupation betting on incorporating the Taliban into Afghanistan government?

[MrGongGong]

The Coalition involvement in Afghanistan was backed by UN authority. Are you now saying that an Afghanistan condemned to Taliban rule is preferable to the almost world-unaminous international rescue action sanctioned by the UN?

Guess what ?
There are more than TWO choices available
I know that's hard for some to understand
but it really is true

[Richard Barrett]

Not invading or threatening is not a necessarily a better policy

Actually I do think it is "necessarily a better policy". How could it not be? What problems are solved by adding to the violence in the world? Your view of humanity is so impoverished it's unbelievable.

[ahinton]

Actually I do think it is "necessarily a better policy". How could it not be? What problems are solved by adding to the violence in the world? Your view of humanity is so impoverished it's unbelievable.

Hear, hear! - although it is surely almost as sad for me to need to endorse what you write here as it is to contemplate the reason why you had to do so in response to that extraordinary remark from A_I_C; "not invading or threatening is not a necessarily a better policy" than what, might one ask?...

[MrGongGong]

What problems are solved by adding to the violence in the world?

:ok:

[Beef Oven]

The Coalition involvement in Afghanistan was backed by UN authority. Are you now saying that an Afghanistan condemned to Taliban rule is preferable to the almost world-unaminous international rescue action sanctioned by the UN?

I think so. As the arguments go in here, although a Taliban-condemned Afghanistan is a sad contemplation, to leave it alone to its fate will mean a lower quantity of 'violence in the world' than otherwise.

[hedgehog]

But those who can get an invisibility cloak may have an advantage for a few nanoseconds!

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-22780651