Are we safe? ATOS spreads dismay ...

[aka Calum Da Jazbo]

Her husband Peter said: “I sat there and listened to my wife drown in her own body fluids. It took half an hour for her to die – and that’s a woman who’s ‘fit for work’. The last months of her life were a misery because she worried about her benefits, feeling useless, like a scrounger.

here



next time the Tories bray like a pack of dogs about scroungers and benefits remember Mrs Wooton; she died persecuted by the State and broke to save the rich from paying tax

[ahinton]

here



next time the Tories bray like a pack of dogs about scroungers and benefits remember Mrs Wooton; she died persecuted by the State and broke to save the rich from paying tax

I think that quite a few people affected by this business and those who know others who are so - along with a number of medico-legal professionals - are already concluding that the system for assessment is failing miserably and that this failure runs the risk of giving rise to cases such as that on which you report here; I will be watching with interest how it all progresses and, as I've said before on the subject, if enough bona fide lawsuits are filed against those responsible for setting up and "running" this system, not only will the financial savings that it's been put up to make be zero but there may well be substantial legal costs to be met, once again by the poor long-suffering taxpayer.

[Serial_Apologist]

Appalling, unforgiveable, but, like so much that is being implemented to "save money", predictable and predicted from the start.

[ahinton]

Appalling, unforgiveable, but, like so much that is being implemented to "save money", predictable and predicted from the start.

And also quite incredibly stupid, not only from the PR point of view but also in terms of it having not at all been thoughts though, not least to the extent that it might risk doing the opposite of "saving money" once the total cost of the likely lawsuits has been factored into it.

[eighthobstruction]

After a quick look at this....

1) It should have been picked up at the first scrutiny of the ESA50....especially as this was a long running problem from 1980's

2) It should have been picked up at face to face assessment, had the correct emphasis been taken (the right questions asked in the right way by a skilled[sic] Atos operative) . It is so poor that the claim was not seen as valid at this point. The Atos Operative should be disciplined for incompetence.

3) It should have been picked up by the pre-appeal 'second look' DWP operative.

4) It should have been picked up at the appeal.

I can only imagine in horror Linda Wotton having/trying to fill out ESA50 and all subsequent paperwork, as well as trying to get evidential letters of support from medical consultants and GP's while she was dangerously and lingeringly ill in a hospital and sick bed.
On first look it would appear to me that Linda Wotton may not have filled in her ESA50 and given other explicit supporting evidence, in as exact and informative a manner as is required , and thus got railroaded by a flawed system that did not properly look/look back on her individual DWP notes, and did not interpret her ESA50 answers. The result was a hideous nightmare for Linda. MANY PEOPLE HAVE PROBLEMS IN GETTING THE RIGHT INFORMATION DOWN ON THE FORMS AND GOOD SUPPORTING EVIDENCE....esp as the ESA50 has just been reduced in size by 10-20%.
It is no good trawling out the "Atos do 20,000 claimants a week", and conclude that x % are right, therefore etc the system works in x% of
cases. The system is fundamentally flawed in the way it misses recognising claimants who should have long term exemption The 20minute average face to face assessment + interaction with LIMA software, with it's nuanced /subtle questions which mislead and elicit the wrong misunderstood/misleading answers, is particularly flawed.

....as are most of my posts....

[MrGongGong]

1) It should have been picked up.......

2) It should have been picked up .....

3) It should have been picked up .........

4) It should have been picked up........

And some people think that we live in a society where it would be safe to allow doctors to prescribe drugs so that people can have voluntary euthanasia ?

[teamsaint]

I am very much afraid that benign views about this king of failing are badly misjudged.

There are very specific agendas to keep most people working as much as possible, for as long as possible, while a fortunate (?) few reap the rewards while telling us how it "needs" to be.

[eighthobstruction]

We are deep in a miasma of incompetence, complexity and cost cutting(which brings in inefficiency)....it's swirling everywhere in every walk of life unfortunately

[teamsaint]

And some people think that we live in a society where it would be safe to allow doctors to prescribe drugs so that people can have voluntary euthanasia ?

Killing people is wrong is how I see it.
most of us have met the 17 year olds who qualify for medical school, and who a few years later might be in a position to make the kinds of decisions you are talking about. very , very scary.

[teamsaint]

We are deep in a miasma of incompetence, complexity and cost cutting....it's swirling everywhere in every walk of life unfortunately

its not just bad lukj though, is it, 8O? Its deliberate.

[eighthobstruction]

Hmmmm (if we are speaking of ESA/Atos)....not completely sure.....or convinced....though there is evidence anecdotal and plain explicit evidence that obfuscation and disingenuousness goes on....I agree to a degree....

[vinteuil]

And some people think that we live in a society where it would be safe to allow doctors to prescribe drugs so that people can have voluntary euthanasia ?

... well, I am very much in favour of voluntary euthanasia, and in many cases doctors will have to be involved. I know you are agin it - but for those who seek release, are there better ways?

[MrGongGong]

... well, I am very much in favour of voluntary euthanasia, and in many cases doctors will have to be involved. I know you are agin it - but for those who seek release, are there better ways?

So I guess you trust more than I do then
These ARE the people who are in charge of these things i'm afraid

[french frank]

most of us have met the 17 year olds who qualify for medical school, and who a few years later might be in a position to make the kinds of decisions you are talking about. very , very scary.

Rather unlikely. My GP has just finished her practice traineeship and must be at least 30. I doubt she would have been making such decisions, nor, probably, would she wish to do so without consultation. Considering what she was like at 17 would seem a bit unfair.

[teamsaint]

Rather unlikely. My GP has just finished her practice traineeship and must be at least 30. I doubt she would have been making such decisions, nor, probably, would she wish to do so without consultation. Considering what she was like at 17 would seem a bit unfair.

A unfair bit , maybe, but worth bearing in mind.
You need the wisdom of Solomon to make such decisions, and quite probably a spectacular strength of character.

In truth there are far too many medics that I have met who shouldn't be allowed anywhere near making that kind of decision. In any case, IMO it should be a no go area.