Huhne

[Mandryka]

People do talk a load of tosh about this
It's fairly clear what the speed limits are
driving too fast is likely to be the cause of death of the person you hit
it's very simple not to drive to fast
and if you do it's also clear what happens
whether you are a doctor , mp or roadsweeper

When I went on a "speed awareness" day out (which is what you get here for going over the limit by a small amount in place of points and a fine) I was amazed at the nonsense one person came out with about how "unjust" it was.

Doctors get paid well enough to be able to afford to take a taxi if they are prosecuted for speeding .......

In 2003--4, I managed to clock up 6 points on my licence, all accrued from speed cameras. The effect was to make me a much more careful driver - previously, I'd had an unblemished licence for fifteen years, though probably more down to luck than anything else. For me, speed cameras, curse them though I do, work.

But they don't seem to work on many other people - in the case of someone like Huhne, a multi-millionaire with a high value property portfolio that means he doesn't actually NEED to work for a living, the financial penalty is negligible but his cavalier attitude to the consequences of his bad driving is scary indeed.

Speed awareness days hadn't yet been introduced when I got my points, but those who've been on them tell me they're quite eye-opening.

[Richard Tarleton]

When I went on a "speed awareness" day out (which is what you get here for going over the limit by a small amount in place of points and a fine) I was amazed at the nonsense one person came out with about how "unjust" it was.

Doctors get paid well enough to be able to afford to take a taxi if they are prosecuted for speeding .......

I went on one of those, and almost half of the other miscreants were female district nurses, midwives, social workers and the like, with large caseloads and too little time to get through them.

You actually pay more than the cost of the fine for the privilege of going on the course, but it's worth it :winkeye:

[Sir Velo]

I went on one of those, and almost half of the other miscreants were female district nurses, midwives, social workers and the like, with large caseloads and too little time to get through them.

Then they need to put that case to their employers. That's not a valid reason for putting the rest of us at jeopardy.

[MrGongGong]

You actually pay more than the cost of the fine for the privilege of going on the course, but it's worth it :winkeye:

Indeed
One of the things I learn't was that I had been assuming the speed limit on a particular stretch of road was 60 when in fact I could have happily been doing 70 :whistle:

Strangely for someone as nonconformist as myself I DID find the experience useful :biggrin:

(but the coffee was terrible hardly the Monsooned Malabar that i'm currently imbibing !)

[amateur51]

I was going to chip in to make similar comments. I got three points quite soon after these cameras first started appearing. It worked. After that I have been much more careful to keep to the limits, which almost certainly means that I am less likely to kill or maim someone.

:ok::ok:

[ahinton]

It's generally considered bad manners to criticise a fellow poster's errors in this way.

If that is indeed the case, the question then arises as to whether what you quote actually constitutes a "criticism" per se or whether it is merely an observation.

Anyway, as I've already mentioned, however, the path taken by this thread seems unfortunately to be one intent on discussing in considerable detail the various merits or otherwise of speed restrictions, licence points, driving bans and punishments for driving offences rather than addressing the principal issue of Huhne's downfall of which his driving transgressions are but a small part, albeit the one without which the remainder could not have occurred.

[amateur51]

If that is indeed the case, the question then arises as to whether what you quote actually constitutes a "criticism" per se or whether it is merely an observation.

If I've made a trypo I'm quite relaxed (in the Mandelsonian sense :winkeye:) about a well-intended correction - after all, a chap doesn't want to appear to be a complete fule :biggrin:

[Richard Tarleton]

Then they need to put that case to their employers. That's not a valid reason for putting the rest of us at jeopardy.

I hope they did. I was making the point in reply to the observations about well-off doctors taking taxis. I wonder how much sympathy they got from their target-driven managers though.

It is clear, if you drive in different parts of the country, that the setting of speed limits is not an exact science. There are general rules - street lights normally mean 30 MPH, and the rules for dual carriageways and motorways are clear enough, but a lot of intermediate speed limits are questionable. Sorry, this is veering off thread. Off to sweep the chimney.

[aka Calum Da Jazbo]

whatever the merits or demerits of the case and the career achievements or failures of the two principals, i feel that this case has become a national embarrassment of truly tragic proportions ... i doubt it will go away since the tabloid rags love it ... and i doubt that their three children will ever escape from the viciousness that will overshadow their whole existence .... if ever there was an instance of too much information in a scandal this is it ...

[MrGongGong]

It is clear, if you drive in different parts of the country, that the setting of speed limits is not an exact science. There are general rules - street lights normally mean 30 MPH, and the rules for dual carriageways and motorways are clear enough, but a lot of intermediate speed limits are questionable. Sorry, this is veering off thread. Off to sweep the chimney.

Aaah now that's one thing I DID learn on my "course" that it actually IS exact but most folk are unclear
I think there's a book with all the rules in ? (NOT THAT ONE Scotty :whistle:)

[french frank]

Aaah now that's one thing I DID learn on my "course" that it actually IS exact but most folk are unclear
I think there's a book with all the rules in ? (NOT THAT ONE Scotty :whistle:)

I got caught on an unfamiliar road just outside Dunstable. My impression was that I was on a dual carriageway on the open road - no street lamps, buildings or pavements or side turnings. When the camera flash went off I looked straight down at my speedometer and I was doing under 50. When I got the fixed penalty notice - the first in decades of driving - I enquired where exactly the camera was placed, geographically. From the Ordnance Survey map I worked out that I was driving through a one an a half mile cutting in the hillside - in the open countryside, but I guessed a side turning up ahead was a danger spot if vehicles on the main road were travelling fast. Of course, I must have passed a 30 or 40 mile limit sign but I didn't register it - you only have to be looking at the oncoming traffic to miss it. I thought of going to court, arguing my case (not going very fast, on an unusual road configuration &c) but in the end I thought that driving up to Dunstable for a court appearance, maybe staying overnight, being found guilty and paying costs as well as a fine wasn't worth it.

The irony was that I was driving from Bristol to Cambridge which can be done almost entirely by motorway, and I chose to go cross-country because I didn't like driving fast in a mini on a motorway and it would be less stressful to take the country route.

[Richard Tarleton]

Aaah now that's one thing I DID learn on my "course" that it actually IS exact but most folk are unclear
I think there's a book with all the rules in ? (NOT THAT ONE Scotty :whistle:)

It's the intermediate ones that are subjective, i.e. 40 and 50 mph limits on country roads that would otherwise be 60. There may well be a rule book, but it's how the rules are interpreted by local politicians and officials that counts :erm:

[MrGongGong]

I think most people (and that dis include me) are unaware of what a "dual carriageway" actually is
but this is getting into middle aged men zone :yawn:

I think you will find that they aren't "subjective" but there are signs to tell you and the placement and pattern of the signs are rigid. The idea that all A roads have a 60mph speed limit is (as I have discovered) "received wisdom".

[Nick Armstrong]

a chap doesn't want to appear to be a complete fule :biggrin:

Some people don't seem that bothered... :whistle:

[Mr Pee]

Indeed
One of the things I learn't was that I had been assuming the speed limit on a particular stretch of road was 60 when in fact I could have happily been doing 70 :whistle:

Strangely for someone as nonconformist as myself I DID find the experience useful :biggrin:

(but the coffee was terrible hardly the Monsooned Malabar that i'm currently imbibing !)

I went on one of those courses late last year, and I found it extremely useful and thought-provoking.

I have always been careful not to speed-( I always use the Sat-Nav as my speedometer, being much more accurate than the dial.) Anyway, despite this, I was "done" for doing exactly 70mph in a 70mph limit-I was driving the work Transit van at the time, and had no idea that different speed limits apply to such vehicles. I was on the A3 south of Guildford, which is a 70 zone, however in a Transit or similar vehicle the limit is 60. Of all the people I work with, only one knew about it. My employers paid the cost of the course, because they were not aware of this either. They have now put a sticker in the windscreen with the correct speed limits. Lesson learnt! :blush:

I do think these courses are a very good alternative to points and a fine. If they make even a few of the participants change their driving then they will have succeeded.

Apart from my van driving, I cycle everywhere, so I'm extremely aware of how few drivers stick to the limits. It is a tiny minority. And then of course there are the idiots who drive along with a mobile phone clamped to their ear. :steam: The problem is that with so few traffic officers out and about these days, the chances of being stopped are few and far between, and whilst cameras can detect speeders, they can't do the same with mobile users.