We're All In This Together .....

[Dave2002]

The problem here is that there are no upper limits to income levels but there has to be a top rate of income tax.

Well I guess most mathematicians or physicists might suggest that 100% could be an upper limit, though ad men and other PR people might think that 110% or 150% or even 1000% would be possible.

[ahinton]

Well I guess most mathematicians or physicists might suggest that 100% could be an upper limit, though ad men and other PR people might think that 110% or 150% or even 1000% would be possible.

That, however, would be theft, not taxation and it would quite obviously run entirely counter to the taxpayer's human rights. Can anyone seriously imagine that anyone subjected to any such rates would do anything other than remove themslelves pronto from the régime that implemented such a daft idea?

[teamsaint]

er not so sure on Vince's pals as this is a view of the impact of raising allownces in cash terms

http://www.ifs.org.uk/images/obs/income_deciles2.gif

from here

The good thing about raising tax allowances is that it is SO valuable to earners/tax payers on low incomes. In cash terms its even better for top rate payers......but that isn't the point.The point is in part about structure. We have an economy built on lots of low earners, and those people need all the help they can get.Increased allowances are expnesive hence the need for restraint in reducing top rates, for now at least.

[amateur51]

"We're All In This Together" says 'My Mate' Dave and his chum Nick.

Well apparently not, according to unpublished Office of National Statistics (ONS) data obtained by the Guardian that reveals that unemployment for young black male jobseekers has risen from 28.8% in 2008 to 55.9% in the last three months of 2011, twice the rate for young white people.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/society/2012/mar/09/half-uk-young-black-men-unemployed

These data should make any serious politician in government cringe, cancel his/her latest brunch with a lobbyis (or a top copper or a newspaper editor) and review the government's youth employment strategy.

This is what I call a 'public interest' story, Mr Murdoch :doh:

[teamsaint]

"We're All In This Together" says 'My Mate' Dave and his chum Nick.

Well apparently not, according to unpublished Office of National Statistics (ONS) data obtained by the Guardian that reveals that unemployment for young black male jobseekers has risen from 28.8% in 2008 to 55.9% in the last three months of 2011, twice the rate for young white people.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/society/2012/mar/09/half-uk-young-black-men-unemployed

These data should make any serious politician in government cringe, cancel his/her latest brunch with a lobbyis (or a top copper or a newspaper editor) and review the government's youth employment strategy.

This is what I call a 'public interest' story, Mr Murdoch :doh:

why would they cancel the lunches?
Not many free lunches to be had from unemployed kids.

They are happy with this state of affairs. It's not an accident. it is designed by them and their banking chums.

[amateur51]

why would they cancel the lunches?
Not many free lunches to be had from unemployed kids.

They are happy with this state of affairs. It's not an accident. it is designed by them and their banking chums.

Such cynicism in one so young, teamsaint :winkeye::biggrin:

[teamsaint]

Such cynicism in one so young, teamsaint :winkeye::biggrin:

cynicism? I see your cynicism and raise you a realism !!

one so young? a bit below average for this board perhaps but..........:sadface:

[amateur51]

cynicism? I see your cynicism and raise you a realism !!

one so young? a bit below average for this board perhaps but..........:sadface:

Sorry teams, it was a tease ::erm::peacedove:

[teamsaint]

Sorry teams, it was a tease ::erm::peacedove:

no offense taken at all Ams........just had one of those birthdays that ends in a zero..........we none of us as young as we once were !!

:smiley:

[amateur51]

no offense taken at all Ams........just had one of those birthdays that ends in a zero..........we none of us as young as we once were !!

:smiley:

Oh congrats, teams :ale::bubbly: - I was 60 just after Crimbo and I must say it's all going rather well :ok::biggrin:

[teamsaint]

Oh congrats, teams :ale::bubbly: - I was 60 just after Crimbo and I must say it's all going rather well :ok::biggrin:

well that's great news Ams.Glad its going well.Since I spend most of my life behind the wheel of a car,I particularly envy you the bus pass !!

[Petrushka]

Can someone enlighten me as to why, if youth unemployment is as high as they are saying it is, the age of retirement is going upwards? This surely makes matters much worse for the young while those who want to retire (as I would love to do) are prevented from doing so thus blocking the way for the next generation. Government (taxpayer) will pay at either end anyway. It makes no sense to me.

[handsomefortune]

what a very common oversight teamsaint's is:

why would they cancel the lunches?
Not many free lunches to be had from unemployed kids.


It's not an accident. it is designed by them and their banking chums.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2012/mar/06/champagne-culture-claims-emma-harrison-a4e

i agree though that a growing number of parasites, as featured in the link, are happy with this state of affairs they love it - all those acres surrounding their stately home, luxury travel, huge pension ....all bought on the backs of 'benefit cheats' and the tax payer..... happily, the guardian link finally illustrates the neat disguise of who's actually cheating who, beautifully, ....this far. (though it looks like some have alreadyover stepped the mark a tad, which i could have predicted myself, on calum da jazbo's 'it's about jobs stupid' thread, a while back. but even i didn't realise the rumble might happen quite so soon as per that particular org).

it's just so brilliant that the accountant examining receipts was 'on the cheap' and blew the whistle - :bubbly: here's to his very good health & continuing success! (and i don't usually say that about accountants tbh)

the plotline should be a west end musical imo! or better still, an opera! :biggrin:

also, having earned a decent salary myself, for a couple of years, dealing with 'benefit cheats' ... (or 'little sh*ts' as some refer to the unemployed as), it is actually a relatively well paid profession. though stressful if you actually do the job properly, give a damn about people. so, i'd say anyone representing the latter approach will probably have to get out earlyish, in order to keep sane, in view of the layers of hipocrisy, + management bs. (i hasten to add i didn't work for an org like jc+ or a4e ...btw, at one time reducing the numbers of workless people, was actually quite constructive, genuinely helpful to the people affected, above anything else). the thing is, if you actually don't do the job properly, then that person is back to square one, unemployed again very rapidly - so it's definitely a job worth doing well initially, unless an org is cheating. practically anyone can get someone else an unpleasant temporary job, and tick boxes ... can't they? but this is a practise which some current govt funded schemes take full advantage of unfortunately.

[teamsaint]

fair comment.........although , as you know, i meant directly , rather than indirectly.
As you imply, dave and his mates can make money out of any situation. Boom and bust keeps us economically fearful......and they make money at all stages of the cycle.
Nice work if you can get it !

[teamsaint]

Can someone enlighten me as to why, if youth unemployment is as high as they are saying it is, the age of retirement is going upwards? This surely makes matters much worse for the young while those who want to retire (as I would love to do) are prevented from doing so thus blocking the way for the next generation. Government (taxpayer) will pay at either end anyway. It makes no sense to me.

I can suggest some reasons.

First, our economic system depends on debt and consumption. Debt keep us in a weak economic situation. What better way of getting a compliant workforce that getting them all thoroughly indebted before ever doing a proper job? Also, the credit fuelled house price boom, entraps them even further.

As to raising retirement ages, i strongly suspect that the very reason for this is indeed to keep the labour market as "competitive" as possible, with attendant falling wage rates.
Furthermore, there is a factor that I feel is little talked about. As pension age rises towards 70 and above, i suspect that many workers will opt for early retirement, on much reduced benefits, rather than slave on for a few more years. This has the effect of reducing the bill on the (company and government robbed) pension funds. A very neat trick.(the same applies to state pension, with NI contributions flowing in nicely as people contribute for 50 years plus).