Murdoch: Ouf! Is this meltdown?

[Flosshilde]

Well, to YOUR rather narrow definition of culture, Floozie. ...

Well, if you read my post again, & more carefully, Mr P, you might be able to work out that I don't exclude the old Currant from 'British Culture', but simply say that it would benefit British Culture (& what that is is open to question) if it disappeared. If it wasn't part of British culture, then its disappearance wouldn't have any effect on the aforesaid culture, would it? As I think I might have said before, do try to pay attention.

And even if The Sun were to go under- which I'm quite certain it won't- you can guarantee that something very similar would quickly take its place. But you probably wouldn't object to that, would you, unless it was another Murdoch paper, in which case no doubt you'd be up on your high horse quicker than I could say "snobbery". :laugh:

If you read my subsequent post (which immediately preceded yours) - "Indeed, but it would be a case of one down, more to follow." - which was a response to anotherbob's comment about the Daily Star, you might be able to understand that I would be delighted if all papers of that type, no matter who they were published by, disappeared.

[amateur51]

...and nobody says it quicker.

or more frequently :laugh:

[amateur51]

careful Ferny I nearly split my stitches :laugh:

EVERYTHING is culture :laugh:

but Cage ????? :laugh: :laugh:

:ok::laugh:

[Mr Pee]

I would be delighted if all papers of that type, no matter who they were published by, disappeared.

Oh well, that's alright then. Just close down all the papers you don't like. Very democratic. :sadface:

[Mr Pee]

careful Ferny I nearly split my stitches :laugh:

EVERYTHING is culture :laugh:

but Cage ????? :laugh: :laugh:

Oh my. Once again you are missing the point spectacularly, Mr. GG :erm:, that point being that culture consists of things we don't like, as well as things that we do. Therefore Cage is part of culture, as is The Sun. I do not read said newspaper, but unlike Floozie I do not therefore think it should "disappear". (Hmmm...making things you don't like disappear- a dangerous path to start down, I would think.)

Equally, I would rather chew on a razor blade than listen to John Cage, but I don't therefore think his "music" should be banned. Whatever floats your boat.

[amateur51]

So are you writing to Rupe, as a long-term subscriber to Sky and relentless advertiser of its products on this Board, to beg him not to close the Sun, Mr Pee? - in the interests of democracy, plurality and photos of women with naked ambitions, natch? :erm::whistle:

I suspect that Rupe will be swayed more by his bottom line :whistle: - oh how I wish I had not tryped that now :yikes::biggrin:

[MrGongGong]

Oh my. Once again you are missing the point spectacularly, Mr. GG :erm:, that point being that culture consists of things we don't like, as well as things that we do. Therefore Cage is part of culture, as is The Sun. I do not read said newspaper, but unlike Floozie I do not therefore think it should "disappear". (Hmmm...making things you don't like disappear- a dangerous path to start down, I would think.)

Equally, I would rather chew on a razor blade than listen to John Cage, but I don't therefore think his "music" should be banned. Whatever floats your boat.

though for YOU music only consists of things that YOU like :laugh:

actually I was laughing AT you
swivelling around trying to preserve your image of Rupe as lord bountiful
bringing nothing but joy into the world

:laugh:

I think (as with the "all soldiers are heroes" script) that there is a problem when politicians bracket everything as "culture" as they will then use this as a means of diminishing one culture over another. There IS a cultural dimension to sport BUT it's not the same as (for example) poetry ! and its NOT a case of "each to their own" as some of my "own" is in danger of being systematically dismantled by Dave and his chums :sadface:

[Mr Pee]

though for YOU music only consists of things that YOU like :laugh:

When have I ever said that? I don't like Verdi or Berlioz, but they most certainly wrote music. Cage did not.

I think (as with the "all soldiers are heroes" script) that there is a problem when politicians bracket everything as "culture" as they will then use this as a means of diminishing one culture over another. There IS a cultural dimension to sport BUT it's not the same as (for example) poetry ! and its NOT a case of "each to their own" as some of my "own" is in danger of being systematically dismantled by Dave and his chums :sadface:

I can well imagine your views on the military. I might have a little more respect for them if you popped over to Helmand province for a few months. At least then you'd have some idea of what you were talking about.

Anyway, I'm glad you mentioned soldiers, since one of the stories that The Sun ran, and which has now led to these arrests, concerned equipment shortages suffered by our armed forces during recent conflicts, a sad state of affairs which may well have contributed to the death and injury of British servicemen. This is why some military personnel have also been arrested. Such a story is surely in the public interest.

The danger with the current ludicrously expensive witch-hunt is that we will end up with a press that is so cowed and weakened that any sort of investigative journalism will be off limits. Do we really want that? As John Sergeant said this morning on the Murnaghan programme, passing a quick bung in the right direction to gain information has been common practice to all newspapers for decades- and many useful and important stories have been uncovered as a result.

If we're not careful, we'll end up with neutered, bland newspapers, which never uncover important stories because they have had their hands tied by over-zealous regulation. :sadface:

[MrGongGong]

When have I ever said that? I don't like Verdi or Berlioz, but they most certainly wrote music. Cage did not.

You just did :laugh:

[aka Calum Da Jazbo]

we have ended up with a bland onanistic celebrity press with their existence threatened by falling circulation and revenues .... it goes without saying that they failed to uncover important stories or worse connived in trying to blot them out ...

it is not a free press the old guard are arguing for [including the Independent] it is a license for the likes of McKenzie and especially Dacre [an unlikely object of hero worship but even M White of the Graun succumbs] to express and exploit their personal pathologies across all the breakfast tables in the land ... arguing that they speak for the ordinary people or England or some other fantasy ... they are all self mythologising and do not serve us that well, fewer better would suffice but most people will not notice ....


it fascinates me how there are similarities between the banks and the press, coteries of middle aged men playing war games with each other in circulation wars or forex markets; these 'macho' cultures anoint leaders and heroes .... 'proper editors' and leading bankers and traders ...they are blithely unaware that their self defined 'common sense' has no further relevance to the rest of us .... we await for the world to puncture their delusional bubbles ... the male defined culture of Britain is dying around us leaving all the middle aged male gurus looking perplexed on tv ....

[amateur51]

..


it fascinates me how there are similarities between the banks and the press, coteries of middle aged men playing war games with each other in circulation wars or forex markets; these 'macho' cultures anoint leaders and heroes .... 'proper editors' and leading bankers and traders ...they are blithely unaware that their self defined 'common sense' has no further relevance to the rest of us .... we await for the world to puncture their delusional bubbles ... the male defined culture of Britain is dying around us leaving all the middle aged male gurus looking perplexed on tv ....

:ok:

[Flosshilde]

The Sun. I do not read said newspaper, but unlike Floozie I do not therefore think it should "disappear".

It does get rather tiring having to explain things to you several times, Mr P. It is NOT because I don't read it that I would be pleased if the Sun was closed. I don't read the Financial Times, but I'm perfectly happy for that to continue. I would be pleased if the Sun was closed because it is a mendacious, scurrilous, salacious rag, run by people who are mendacious, scurrilous and salacious, that has helped to depress popular culture.

[aka Calum Da Jazbo]

yippeeee!!!!!!!!!!!!

Indie today

Eight arrests as Murdoch 'throws staff to the wolves'

Murdoch hit by threat of new legal fight in US

[Globaltruth]

we have ended up with a bland onanistic celebrity press with their existence threatened by falling circulation and revenues .... it goes without saying that they failed to uncover important stories or worse connived in trying to blot them out ...

it is not a free press the old guard are arguing for [including the Independent] it is a license for the likes of McKenzie and especially Dacre [an unlikely object of hero worship but even M White of the Graun succumbs] to express and exploit their personal pathologies across all the breakfast tables in the land ... arguing that they speak for the ordinary people or England or some other fantasy ... they are all self mythologising and do not serve us that well, fewer better would suffice but most people will not notice ....


it fascinates me how there are similarities between the banks and the press, coteries of middle aged men playing war games with each other in circulation wars or forex markets; these 'macho' cultures anoint leaders and heroes .... 'proper editors' and leading bankers and traders ...they are blithely unaware that their self defined 'common sense' has no further relevance to the rest of us .... we await for the world to puncture their delusional bubbles ... the male defined culture of Britain is dying around us leaving all the middle aged male gurus looking perplexed on tv ....

Yes, I like this post too, and to complement it, here is an interesting article from the Sun

http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/news/4124870/The-Suns-Trevor-Kavanagh-Witch-hunt-puts-us-behind-ex-Soviet-states-on-Press-freedom.html

last thrashings of an onanist?

[Mr Pee]

Yes, I like this post too, and to complement it, here is an interesting article from the Sun

http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/news/4124870/The-Suns-Trevor-Kavanagh-Witch-hunt-puts-us-behind-ex-Soviet-states-on-Press-freedom.html

last thrashings of an onanist?

Yes, a very interesting article. And one that I think raises many important points, with which any neutral observer would surely agree. But I don't expect any of you lot will, delighting as you are in this ridiculous witch-hunt. :sadface: