Militant students at Warwick

[ahinton]

'When I use a word,' Humpty Dumpty said in rather a scornful tone, 'it means just what I choose it to mean — neither more nor less.'

Oh, mon Dieu, if only I had ten euros for every time I've quoted that one, I wouldn't be in the mess that I'm in now!

But never mind that; what indeed is "faux-leftism"? - and who are its representatives and by what can they be identified? - pianists who try but fail to play the Chopin/Godowsky left hand studies, peut-être? - in which case fax-rightists will be having a hard time of it, given that they have so much smaller a repertoire...

[P. G. Tipps]

Quite - I don't think it would take much less than a Black & Decker to the cranium to convince you of anything, if you don't mind me saying.

No that won't work either if you don't mind me saying ... a Draper might be your best bet.

[P. G. Tipps]

I don't think you have to be particularly intolerant and unsympathetic to find Rod Liddle repulsive - I have plenty of sympathy, but it's reserved for the wife he abandoned on their honeymoon to fly back to be with his mistress.

(This reply is especially for PG, who has I believe a deeply tradtitional view of marriage. For everyone else, here is Will Self reviewing Liddle's recent book.)

.

Who's Will Self do I now hear some innocently protest ... ? :laugh:

I have no interest in the private life of Mr Liddle however disreputable ... that is the sole affair of himself and those affected.

It is interesting, though, that not only does Mr Self understand what the Faux-Left is, he says he actually agrees with Mr Liddle!

[Richard Barrett]

It would be interesting to know what the accusers of "faux-leftism" would make of real leftists, if one presumes them to exist in their minds.

That might help clarify things here.

Maybe.

Taking scotty's sage advice, I had a look in my dictionary for "faux left". Not there I'm afraid. So I went to an online dictionary instead, and instead of a definition was served up with a link to a Spectator article entitled "Rod Liddle is right about the faux Left"... which suggests, as I said, that whatever currency this term might have is restricted to the ("vrai"?) right, and thus to circles I don't move in.

The closest (not very close at all unfortunately) the article gets to defining what "faux left" means is this: Perhaps one of the worst aspects of the rise of the faux Left is that it has allowed mostly privileged people to consolidate power, just as Michael Young predicted, while losing their sense of gratitude and noblesse oblige. Our institutions are stuffed full of privately-educated people who pay lip service to the idea of opening up the system to women, minorities and the poor, but it’s never at the expense of them or their kids. Having the right opinions is just another way of denoting group membership, along with the place in the south of France and the Oxbridge degree.

Weird. There I was thinking we were currently ruled by Tories. Who are these people referred to above who are running things behind the scenes? and why is the Spectator so exercised about them? The mystery deepens...

[ahinton]

There I was thinking we were currently ruled by Tories. Who are these people referred to above who are running things behind the scenes? and why is the Spectator so exercised about them? The mystery deepens...

Yes, but in reality we're ruled by the Tories in coalition with the Libdemocratories with the (non-)Socialistories in opposition although, following the next UK General Election, we might not be as much ruled as is the case now, especially if the Ukiptories and Scotnatories further muddy the waters. Whilst I don't understand what's suppsedly meant by "faux left" either, I suppose that it might at least imply that what whoever they are have in common with the faux right and the faux inbetweens (assuming there to be room for any such) is that they're all politicians and so mostly faux to the extent that such fauxness goes with the terri-tory.

[jean]

...I don't understand what's suppsedly meant by "faux left" either...

It involves a degree of hypocrisy and Diane Abbot does typify this (I am sorry to say) in that while claiming to support State education, she sent her son to private school. Here she is justifying her decision:

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/diane-abbott-i-sent-my-son-to-private-230293

[Richard Barrett]

Diane Abbot does typify this (I am sorry to say) in that while claiming to support State education, she sent her son to private school.

I had come across this hypocritical decision of hers before, to be sure. So "faux left" means someone like Diane Abbott (sic)... I thought that might be the case, but I was unsure because right-wing commentators from Beef Oven to the author of the Spectator article I quoted seem to be of the opinion that such people are basically controlling the agenda of public discourse, or at least that they're massively more important than surely is the case.

[jean]

...such people are basically controlling the agenda of public discourse, or at least that they're massively more important than surely is the case.

The problem with them for me is that they're occupying the places where the real left should be - like the Labour party.

[Richard Barrett]

The problem with them for me is that they're occupying the places where the real left should be - like the Labour party.

The "real left" hasn't had much influence in the Labour Party for a very long time.

[ahinton]

The "real left" hasn't had much influence in the Labour Party for a very long time.

It's had precious little influnce anywhere within the demi-monde of British politics since Thatcher came to power; this is part of a fundamental problem of there being no real "opposition" as such.

[Beef Oven!]

We have the Faux-left and now the "real left". Are there other lefts, or is it just these two?

And can someone give me a CliffsNotes-style definition of the "real-left", please?

[Beef Oven!]

It is interesting, though, that not only does Mr Self understand what the Faux-Left is, he says he actually agrees with Mr Liddle!

Yes indeed (thanks for the link, Jean).

He seems to agree with Liddle's detail, as well as the broad brush; and for a minute there, I thought he was going to go the whole hog, but he pulled up short of agreeing that diversity not only has a positive impact on society, but it might have negative consequences too. Maybe Will has to build up to that one!

[ahinton]

We have the Faux-left and now the "real left". Are there other lefts, or is it just these two?

In so saying, you remind me of Sorabji's barb "we've had the Third Reich and now Steve Reich; how many less could we have?"...

As I thought that it had largely been established by a number of people here that the definition of the term "faux left" and the identities of its members/supporters are matters of some considerable doubt, one might question the point of trying to define the apparently undefinable and move one; having done that, there is "the left" and it would be called the "real left" only to distinguish it from whatever people who still use the term "faux left" think that said term might mean. OK, the manifestation of "the left" in Britain remains of fragmented appearance, if Wiki (see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_Left) is anything by which to go on the subject:

"Other organisations

The next largest Party [after the Labour Party] is the Green Party, followed by the Respect Party which has the support of: Communist Party of Great Britain (Provisional Central Committee), the Socialist Unity Network, Socialist Resistance and the Revolutionary Communist Party of Britain (Marxist-Leninist). Respect allows its members to hold membership of other political organisations, and people of no other political organisation. Respect's only Member of Parliament is George Galloway who is also the leader of Respect.[1]

Respect's first electoral test was the 2004 Greater London Authority elections, in which Lindsey German came fifth. In the 2005 general election, the Respect Coalition won 68,065 votes. By the time of the 2008 Greater London Authority elections, the Socialist Workers Party had left the coalition amid an acrimonious dispute with George Galloway and instead contested the elections as the Left List with Lindsey German as candidate (coming eighth). Since the split the two factions have become Respect Renewal (now simply Respect) and the Left Alternative.

Trade Unionist and Socialist Coalition (won 26,765 votes in the English local elections 2011)
Socialist Labour Party (won 19,529 votes in the 2005 general election)
Socialist Party (England and Wales) stands as Socialist Alternative in elections (won 9,398 votes in the 2005 general election)
Alliance for Green Socialism (won 1,978 votes in the 2005 general election)
Workers' Revolutionary Party (won 1,143 votes in the 2005 general election)
Communist Party of Britain (won 1,124 votes in the 2005 general election)
Independent Working Class Association (won 892 votes in the UK general election)
Democratic Labour Party (won 770 votes in the 2005 general election)
Alliance for Workers Liberty stand as Socialist Unity in elections (won 581 votes in the 2005 general election)
Social Democratic Party (UK, 1990–)

Fewer than 500 votes

Including those who did not stand on principle or for practical reasons

Communist League of Great Britain
Communist League (UK, 1990)
Communist Party of Britain (Marxist-Leninist) (backed Labour under Thatcher to vote-out the Conservatives)
Communist Party of Great Britain (Marxist-Leninist) (formed from former members of the SLP)
Communist Party of Great Britain (Provisional Central Committee)
Communist Workers Organisation
Democratic Socialist Alliance
Economic and Philosophic Science Review
International Communist Current
New Communist Party of Britain (backs Labour)
Peace and Progress Party
People's Party (formed from former members of Labour)
Permanent Revolution (group)
Red Party (formed by former members of the CPGB PCC)
Revolutionary Communist Group
Revolutionary Communist Party of Britain (Marxist-Leninist)
Revolutionary Democratic Group
Socialist Action
Socialist Appeal (supports the Labour Party candidates)
Socialist Equality Party (formed from former members of the WRP)
Socialist Party of Great Britain
Spartacist League
Socialist Workers Party
Workers Power
Patriotic Socialist Party [2]

Active only in Scotland

Scottish Socialist Party
Solidarity (Scotland)
Scottish National Party
Scottish Labour Party
Communist Party of Great Britain (Marxist-Leninist)

Active only in Wales

Plaid Cymru
Welsh Labour
Socialist Party Wales

This may not quite be the "CliffsNotes-style definition of the "real-left"", whatever that may be, but it's the best that I think I can do for now...

[jean]

We have the Faux-left and now the "real left"...

Without at least the idea of a "real left", there couldn't be a faux version, could there?

So your question is pointless.

[Beef Oven!]

Without at least the idea of a "real left", there couldn't be a faux version, could there?

So your question is pointless.

The question is fine. Are there other lefts, and, now that we've had a definition of the Faux-left, let's have a definition of the "real left"?(especially given the mysterious inverted commas put there by RB). Unless the "real left" is all those who are not the Faux-left.