State of the parties as 2015 General Election looms.

[ahinton]

'They don't
There's nothing "radically different" about them at all.'
'Your opinion might be "very humble" but it's also wrong;'
Well, that's the result of getting back on topic, I see

I doubt that. It seems to me to be rather more the "result" of lack of due thought, not least in your omission to attempt to corroborate your assertion that "the Greens have simply occupied the territory once occupied by the Lib Dems" with explanatory evidence; in what specific respects do you see the Greens of today occupying the LibDems of yesteryear's territory?

The LibDems today are, as I imagine you'd agree, in a pretty parlous state whereas the reputation of the Greens, however unsupported (so far) by voter evidence, appears at least to be in the ascendant so, whatever else the Greens appear to be doing, they don't seem to be falling into the slough of "the party that once was" and whose erstwhile leader once, with gross over-optimism arguably approaching insanity, publicly urged his party functionaries to go back to their constituencies and prepare for government (as distinct from risking losing their despoits as seems increasingly likely today).

[B]might as well watch the footy. :laugh:

If that's the best up with which you can come, then perhaps so...

[jean]

...the Greens...promise just about everything to anybody...

I'm not sure they're offering much that would be to your taste. Or Beefy's.

[ahinton]

I'm not sure they're offering much that would be to your taste. Or Beefy's.

I couldn't (and indeed wouldn't seek to) speak for either the forum teaboy or M. le Rosbif, but at least the latter did respond to a post about the Greens' policies by writing
Indeed. I would agree with all of those statements, but I would need to know how they plan to do it.

[jean]

Apologies to him, then - he's not beyond hope.

[aeolium]

It's interesting that people can remark of a fairly new party that "they know they will never form a government" as if we were discussing the relatively monolithic politics of 40 years ago. Have a look at some of the recent changes in Europe described in this article:

http://www.theguardian.com/news/datablog/2014/nov/06/podemos-a-crisis-of-trust-and-the-rise-of-new-political-parties

Not only Podemos, which didn't exist as a party a year ago but now has 270,000 members, but other parties are making dramatic inroads into what used to be called the core vote of the traditional parties. Syriza in Greece and the Italian Five Star Movement are also examples of parties that have come from nowhere - it's quite possible that Syriza will form the next Greek government if elections take place early in the new year. And together with the rise of small or new parties has been the sometimes spectacular collapse of large parties. PASOK in Greece which for long was either the governing or the main opposition party is now polling around 5%. And not just in Europe - the Progressive Conservatives in Canada went from being the majority party in government to winning only 2 seats in 1993. Even though we haven't seen such volatility here there's no doubt that elections are becoming far harder to predict, even in the wretched FPTP system we have.

[P. G. Tipps]

I'm not sure they're offering much that would be to your taste. Or Beefy's.

Well, afaik, they are pro-EU so that is certainly to my taste ....

It is not helpful to pigeonhole members who often disagree with you into the same group. Beefy and I will both agree and disagree on many things, I'm sure!

[Flosshilde]

There you go, missing out the Greens again.

According to other experts:

LABOUR 35%
CONSERVATIVES 30%
UKIP 16%
GREENS 8%
LIBDEMS 6%
SNP/PC 4%

SNP 4% of what? Certainly not the electorate who will be able to vote for them - as far as I know they're not planning to put up any candidates outside Scotland; it will be rather more than 4% I think.

(What 'other experts' did you consult?)

[P. G. Tipps]

I couldn't (and indeed wouldn't seek to) speak for either the forum teaboy or M. le Rosbif, but at least the latter did respond to a post about the Greens' policies by writing
Indeed. I would agree with all of those statements, but I would need to know how they plan to do it.

I wholly agree, ahinton ...

[P. G. Tipps]

Your opinion might be "very humble" but it's also wrong; ask any Green or LibDem supporter (assuming that you can find any of the latter to ask).


So does UKIP; in fact, its leader has publicly admitted as much!


Are you sure where that "centre" is?


I think that it would be wise to await the results of the next General Election before assuming whether UKIP "stands" at all and whether it has actually achieved anything that could reasonably be described as "success"...

Spot on, ahinton ...

[P. G. Tipps]

I doubt that. It seems to me to be rather more the "result" of lack of due thought, not least in your omission to attempt to corroborate your assertion that "the Greens have simply occupied the territory once occupied by the Lib Dems" with explanatory evidence; in what specific respects do you see the Greens of today occupying the LibDems of yesteryear's territory?

The LibDems today are, as I imagine you'd agree, in a pretty parlous state whereas the reputation of the Greens, however unsupported (so far) by voter evidence, appears at least to be in the ascendant so, whatever else the Greens appear to be doing, they don't seem to be falling into the slough of "the party that once was" and whose erstwhile leader once, with gross over-optimism arguably approaching insanity, publicly urged his party functionaries to go back to their constituencies and prepare for government (as distinct from risking losing their despoits as seems increasingly likely today).


If that's the best up with which you can come, then perhaps so...

My thoughts entirely, ahinton ...! :OK:

[jean]

(What 'other experts' did you consult?)

I gave you a link.

[Flosshilde]

Oh yes, I see. I thought you'd put the text in red as emphasis.

[MrGongGong]

I gave you a link.

The demographics are interesting
Lets hope that younger folks don't become the same old disillusioned drudges that many of the parents have become.

Though some think people should "grow up" :sad face:

[Eine Alpensinfonie]

SNP 4% of what? Certainly not the electorate who will be able to vote for them - as far as I know they're not planning to put up any candidates outside Scotland; it will be rather more than 4% I think.

If Alex Salmond were to be a candidate in the Malton/Thirsk ward, I'd vote for him.

[Flosshilde]

I wouldn't, & won't be voting SNP. I don't hold with the view that 'all politicians are liars and cheats', but I'd make an exception in his case.