State of the parties as 2015 General Election looms.

[P. G. Tipps]

Really? Try reminding yourself of that next time you make use of any facilities provided to you by an outfit calling itself NHS but, in the interim, have a look at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of...United_Kingdom and http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of...gdom_employers where you will see that NHS employs almost 1.5m people; UK's largest corporate employer, Tesco, employs less than half the number of people that NHS does! That said, I also did not suggest that private industry is "separate from society" and it would be patently absurd to do so since it employs members of society just as state departments do.

Yes really again, ahinton!

According to official government sources public sector employment was just under 20% of total employment in mid-2013, which my trusty calculator confirms is just over 80% for the private sector.

Your previous stated 'concern' that private industry does not do enough to contribute towards society is clearly just as patently absurd on that single basis alone.

[amateur51]

Yes really again, ahinton!

According to official government sources public sector employment was just under 20% of total employment in mid-2013, which my trusty calculator confirms is just over 80% for the private sector.

Your previous stated 'concern' that private industry does not do enough to contribute towards society is clearly just as patently absurd on that single basis alone.

What percentage of those employed by the private sector claimed Housing Benefit, Working Tax Credits, Child Credits etc etc during the period that your unspecified and unsourced figures cover? How many were employed part-time? And on zero-hours contracts? Do Pay Day loan companies count as part of the private sector?

[MrGongGong]

Pay Day loan companies

How wonderful is the entrepreneurial spirit in the UK today.

:-(

[P. G. Tipps]

... your unspecified and unsourced figure ...

Don't be silly, even I'm not that stupid ... :laugh:

http://www.ons.gov.uk/ons/rel/pse/public-sector-employment/q2-2013/sty-public-section-employment.html

One could hardly expect a figure more officially 'specified' and 'sourced' or whatever any other fancy words you can up with ... ?

How many were employed part-time? And on zero-hours contracts? Do Pay Day loan companies count as part of the private sector?

Of course they do alongside the overwhelming majority of respectable loan companies and private sector workers who are on full-time contracts with their employers. Are you suggesting there are no workers on part-time contracts and on low pay in the public sector?

[ahinton]

Yes really again, ahinton!

According to official government sources

You'd trust those implicitly, would you?...

public sector employment was just under 20% of total employment in mid-2013, which my trusty calculator confirms is just over 80% for the private sector.

Your previous stated 'concern' that private industry does not do enough to contribute towards society is clearly just as patently absurd on that single basis alone.

I didn't even say that private industry didn't "do enough"; I merely pointed out that it's by no means as cut-and-dried as you are tying to make out - and your recourse to government statistics don't help your case particularly...

But in any case, for what it may or may not be worth, please see the final paragraph of #927...

[P. G. Tipps]

You'd trust those implicitly, would you?...


I didn't even say that private industry didn't "do enough"; I merely pointed out that it's by no means as cut-and-dried as you are tying to make out - and your recourse to government statistics don't help your case particularly...

Isn't 'government' part of the public sector?

Don't you trust public sector statistics, ahinton, or would you prefer the private sector to take over that role?

[amateur51]

Don't be silly, even I'm not that stupid ... :laugh:

http://www.ons.gov.uk/ons/rel/pse/public-sector-employment/q2-2013/sty-public-section-employment.html

One could hardly expect a figure more officially 'specified' and 'sourced' or whatever any other fancy words you can up with ... ?



Of course they do alongside the overwhelming majority of respectable loan companies and private sector workers who are on full-time contracts with their employers. Are you suggesting there are no workers on part-time contracts and on low pay in the public sector?

The subject at hand was the 80% employed in the private sector, that great unalloyed creator of wealth, so why would I do that?

Thanks for the sources but what shame I had to ask, wasn't it?!

Another shame is that you haven't even tried to answer my questions.

Par for the course though really.

[P. G. Tipps]

But in any case, for what it may or may not be worth, please see the final paragraph of #927...

Yes, delighted to note that you have a rich if dry sense of humour, ahinton!

[P. G. Tipps]

The subject at hand was the 80% employed in the private sector, that great unalloyed creator of wealth, so why would I do that?

Thanks for the sources but what shame I had to ask, wasn't it?!

Another shame is that you haven't even tried to answer my questions.

Par for the course though really.

Oh I dunno ... more like an effortless albatross really. :winkeye:

[ahinton]

Isn't 'government' part of the public sector?

Don't you trust public sector statistics, ahinton, or would you prefer the private sector to take over that role?

Yes, no and no, in that order.

[Eine Alpensinfonie]

Isn't 'government' part of the public sector?

Clearly it isn't, as they have voted themselves a big pay rise, while the useful public sector continues to be frozen, squeezed and pulped.

[Serial_Apologist]

In the long term it isn't even physically possible I would think.

And we have the claim that entrepreneurs are wealth creators endlessly regurgitated on this thread.

What or who actually does create wealth lies buried under macromonetary movements using computers to try and match up the balances between individual, corporate and state spending and the rate of money supply to try to ensure the latter does not too far exceed the former, thus causing inflation. What's hidden is the amount of socially, environmentally and commercially unsustainable spending included in all that as a result of multiplicities of blind planning decisions made by grossly overpaid directorships to get people to buy obsolescent stuff that wouldn't be nearly as obsolescent under a planned system to have stuff they never knew they wanted in the first place in order to keep up with current notions of "cool", because capitalism needs the blind decisionmaking otherwise known as commercial secrecy in order to be competitive; and without competitive we'd all be lying around getting stoned out of our heads or gardening, presumably.

Having the money supply running in tandem with expenditure of all sorts is a neat acknoswledgement of the fact that money ultimately rests on value, which consists in the transmogrification of base materials into eventual commodities, with value added at every stage, and a bit of it ripped off to keep those whom society's creeps and sycophants call wealth creators safe for themselves from the seething hoardes.

But you won't learn this from the Sun, Mail, Express, Telegraph, and only occasionally frolm the Independent, Guardian and even more occasionally the BBC.

[Beef Oven!]

And we have the claim that entrepreneurs are wealth creators endlessly regurgitated on this thread.

What or who actually does create wealth lies buried under macromonetary movements using computers to try and match up the balances between individual, corporate and state spending and the rate of money supply to try to ensure the latter does not too far exceed the former, thus causing inflation. What's hidden is the amount of socially, environmentally and commercially unsustainable spending included in all that as a result of multiplicities of blind planning decisions made by grossly overpaid directorships to get people to buy obsolescent stuff that wouldn't be nearly as obsolescent under a planned system to have stuff they never knew they wanted in the first place in order to keep up with current notions of "cool", because capitalism needs the blind decisionmaking otherwise known as commercial secrecy in order to be competitive; and without competitive we'd all be lying around getting stoned out of our heads or gardening, presumably.

Having the money supply running in tandem with expenditure of all sorts is a neat acknoswledgement of the fact that money ultimately rests on value, which consists in the transmogrification of base materials into eventual commodities, with value added at every stage, and a bit of it ripped off to keep those whom society's creeps and sycophants call wealth creators safe for themselves from the seething hoardes.

But you won't learn this from the Sun, Mail, Express, Telegraph, and only occasionally frolm the Independent, Guardian and even more occasionally the BBC.

Oh dear.

[Risorgimento]

And we have the claim that entrepreneurs are wealth creators endlessly regurgitated on this thread.

What or who actually does create wealth lies buried under macromonetary movements using computers to try and match up the balances between individual, corporate and state spending and the rate of money supply to try to ensure the latter does not too far exceed the former, thus causing inflation. What's hidden is the amount of socially, environmentally and commercially unsustainable spending included in all that as a result of multiplicities of blind planning decisions made by grossly overpaid directorships to get people to buy obsolescent stuff that wouldn't be nearly as obsolescent under a planned system to have stuff they never knew they wanted in the first place in order to keep up with current notions of "cool", because capitalism needs the blind decisionmaking otherwise known as commercial secrecy in order to be competitive; and without competitive we'd all be lying around getting stoned out of our heads or gardening, presumably.

Having the money supply running in tandem with expenditure of all sorts is a neat acknoswledgement of the fact that money ultimately rests on value, which consists in the transmogrification of base materials into eventual commodities, with value added at every stage, and a bit of it ripped off to keep those whom society's creeps and sycophants call wealth creators safe for themselves from the seething hoardes.

But you won't learn this from the Sun, Mail, Express, Telegraph, and only occasionally frolm the Independent, Guardian and even more occasionally the BBC.

I see the medications' stopped working.

[P. G. Tipps]

... society's creeps and sycophants call wealth creators ...

Oh, come on, even society's creeps and sycophants can call it correctly...

But you won't learn this from the Sun, Mail, Express, Telegraph, and only occasionally frolm the Independent, Guardian and even more occasionally the BBC.

Of course you won't because newspaper editors (if not the BBC) know their customers well and if they ever printed such weary and predictable old Marxist stuff the newspapers would quickly end up in the waste-bin and never bought again!

And that equally applies to the presumably deliberately omitted Mirror as well, of course ...