Yes or No and no bullsh*t

[french frank]

Now having lived in England for most of my life I'd say the English are just as 'nationalist' as the Scots. Ask him or her their nationality and many (if not most) will automatically reply 'English' instead of 'British'. So why the apparent disapproval of some south of the border of the self-label 'Scottish' rather than "British"?

That surprises me. Factually, I am English but think of myself as British (& European). 'English' holds very little meaning.

[ahinton]

That surprises me. Factually, I am English but think of myself as British (& European). 'English' holds very little meaning.

Indeed - and it'll likely hold even less if Devo-Max in England leads to the kind of federalism of which one outcome might eventually be the establishment of the Democratic Republic of Bristol...

[Beef Oven!]

But is it a question? It has already been agreed to hold one. The only factor that might affect that (now that Scotland has voted narrowly against "independence") might be the need for due consideration that, as a post-referendum Devo-Maxed Scotland will have less appetite to vote in favour of UK secession from EU, it would stand a better chance of helping to ensure that the UK electorate as a whole would vote against UK leaving EU than would have been the case had it opted instead for "independence" yesterday, thereby giving itself no say in the matter.

Agreed? Perhaps.

But I'd like one in the next 6 months.

[P. G. Tipps]

That surprises me. Factually, I am English but think of myself as British (& European). 'English' holds very little meaning.

Of course everyone is different and I can only go by my own personal experience. It is also true that some people south of the border do tend to confuse 'English' and 'British' so maybe the former self-description is somewhat inadvertent.

As for me I consider myself to be proudly Scottish, British and European ... sadly, I haven't quite yet made the leap to 'Internationalist'!

[MrGongGong]

Agreed? Perhaps.

But I'd like one in the next 6 months.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c9mGtDGzoSA

[richardfinegold]

Scotland Referendum

So....y'all still one Country over there?

[Nick Armstrong]

Och aye.

I'm hoping that there will be fewer Scottish politicians on the television and radio, starting today :yikes:

[Beef Oven!]

Och aye.

I'm hoping that there will be fewer Scottish politicians on the television and radio, starting today :yikes:

:ok:

And that's to say nothing of all the 'professional' Scottish bores and "I'm Scottish, but I live in Romford and it's wrong I can't vote", contingent!!

[Hornspieler]

So....y'all still one Country over there?

No.

We still have the North/South Divide, just like in the USA! :winkeye:

HS :hug:

[Beef Oven!]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c9mGtDGzoSA

Oi! You cheeky so-and-so! I put that reference to you often! How dare you turn it back on me!! ;-)

Always loved that song! Thumbs-up icon!

[richardfinegold]

No.

We still have the North/South Divide, just like in the USA! :winkeye:

HS :hug:

In it's desire to boost ratings for news coverage, the U.S. Media tends to over dramatize news from abroad. There was discussion about the future of NATO if the yes vote won, and some commentators predicted an Alliance between ISIS and Scottish Nationalists, ready to storm the beaches of Florida and behead us unless we ate haggis.

[Pabmusic]

In it's desire to boost ratings for news coverage, the U.S. Media tends to over dramatize news from abroad. There was discussion about the future of NATO if the yes vote won, and some commentators predicted an Alliance between ISIS and Scottish Nationalists, ready to storm the beaches of Florida and behead us unless we ate haggis.

I've often thought that the US media don't live in the real world. :smiley:

[Honoured Guest]

I've often thought that the US media don't live in the real world. :smiley:

I realise that the posts above are principally intended to be flippant and to raise a chuckle, and not to comment seriously on the independence referendum, but it disappoints me that they seem to demonstrate a profound misunderstanding of the matter, even here in the UK, and even after the eventual proper coverage by the UK media.

Independence would have provided a more democratic model to the people of Scotland. The views of the Scottish diaspora are not directly relevant to that. And "Scottishness" and haggis are also largely irrelevant.

[ahinton]

Agreed? Perhaps.

But I'd like one in the next 6 months.

We've just had the Scottish "independence" referendum, we're about to get a whole bunch of Devo-Max thrust first upon Scotland and then inevitably upon the other three UK member states and there's a General Election scheduled for around 8 months' time, yet you seriously want an in/out EU referendum in UK by next March? Here's the historical timeline for the Scottish "independence" referendum, extracted from Wiki:

The SNP repeated its commitment to hold a referendum when it published its 2011 Scottish parliamentary election manifesto. Days before the election, Salmond stated that legislation for a referendum would be proposed in the "2nd half of the parliament", as he wanted to secure more powers for the Scottish Parliament via the Scotland Bill first. The SNP gained an overall majority in the election, winning 69 from 129 seats, thereby gaining a mandate to hold an independence referendum.

In January 2012, the UK government offered to legislate to provide the Scottish Parliament with the powers to hold a referendum, providing it was "fair, legal and decisive". This would set "terms of reference for the referendum", such as its question(s), elector eligibility and which body would organise the vote. As the UK government worked on legal details, including the timing of the vote, Salmond announced an intention to hold the referendum in the autumn of 2014. Negotiations continued between the two governments until October 2012, when the Edinburgh Agreement was reached.

The Scottish Independence Referendum (Franchise) Act 2013 was passed by the Scottish Parliament on 27 June 2013 and received Royal Assent on 7 August 2013. On 15 November 2013, the Scottish government published Scotland's Future, a 670-page white paper laying out the case for independence and the means through which Scotland might become an independent country.

Now all that was only for the possible "independence" of Scotland from UK in which there were valid votes totalling 3,619,915 from an electorate of 4,283,392; do you seriously expect it to be seen as reasonable, in a vastly shorter time-frame, to hold a UK EU in/out referendum in which nearly 50 million people would be eligible to vote?

The Scottish referendum was based on a raft of flawed, unexplained, uncertain and potentially anomalous premises; you can just imagine what your hastily cobbled together EU one would be, surerly?! And while you're at it, don't forget that, as Scotland's still part of UK, its citizens' votes will help to reduce the overall proportion of "Yes" ones in a UK EU in/out referendum as would not have been possible had yesterday's referendum resulted in a "Yes" victory!

[ahinton]

Of course everyone is different and I can only go by my own personal experience. It is also true that some people south of the border do tend to confuse 'English' and 'British' so maybe the former self-description is somewhat inadvertent.

As for me I consider myself to be proudly Scottish, British and European ... sadly, I haven't quite yet made the leap to 'Internationalist'!

It's perhaps as well that you are not Québecois; if you were, you'd probably be so fed up with being inaccurately described as "French-Canadian" that you'd be happy just to be able to make a leap past that one!