Scotland to charge for plastic bags

[teamsaint]

Of course it's not 'useless', unless you believe that dealing with one issue rules out dealing with any others.

The Welsh have been charging for ages.

http://www.carrierbagchargewales.gov.uk/?skip=1&lang=en

In my opinion it is a very real distraction from much more important issues, and thus useless.

You do indeed have to start somewhere. But this is not the place to start.the place to start is with producers who create products that fail too quickly and are non recyclable. Also,Check out the waste in the average supermarket trolley. 95 % of the waste is not in free plastic bags, its in wrapping on things like grapes, for example.
At the consumer end, I would ban or tax patio heaters much more harshly, deal much more harshly with brand new gas guzzling cars, and so on.

Al the time people are discussing a charge on carrier bags, they are not discussing the real, vital consumption issues in our society and world. My strong suspicion that governments choose this issue, because it is visible, and makes people feel as though they are contributing, when in fact its a very marginal issue indeed.


Anyway, i reuse my plastic bags many times, so I can feel like I am doing my bit when I put my lunch in them , and I can also feel content that i haven't put some poor bag manufacturer out of work.

[jean]

...I can also feel content that i haven't put some poor bag manufacturer out of work.

What about the poor manufacturers of all the other waste in the average supermarket trolley? Don't they deserve the same consideration?

[teamsaint]

What about the poor manufacturers of all the other waste in the average supermarket trolley? Don't they deserve the same consideration?

Well they presumably need a job.

These are not , I suspect, jobs in middle class enclaves though.

[jean]

No, they're probably in China.

I really find that bit of your argument most extraordinary.

[teamsaint]

No, they're probably in China.

I really find that bit of your argument most extraordinary.

It really was meant to be the lighthearted bit, Jean. Although of course this does have repercussions for folk.

The distraction is the bit that bothers me. i don't like pollution, litter or waste any more than anybody else.

[jean]

...The distraction is the bit that bothers me. i don't like pollution, litter or waste any more than anybody else.

I don't know why you assume it's a distraction, though.

I find that having to think about one sort of pollution, litter or waste just makes me think more about the others. Why do you think I'm unique in this?

Reminds me of the argument that if you concern yourself with animal welfare, you don't care about humans.

[MrGongGong]

In my opinion it is a very real distraction from much more important issues, and thus useless.

I feel the same about football

[Eine Alpensinfonie]

If Morrisons start charging, I'm switching to Asda.

Out of the frying pan into the fire.

[teamsaint]

I feel the same about football

And I would agree that the all pervasive nature of moden football acts to distract many peoplle from more pressing matters.football is a fine entertainment, but it has become too important and distracting.

[Beef Oven!]

I feel the same about football

Philistine! The rules of association football is the greatest achievement of the human race.

[Flosshilde]

The distraction is the bit that bothers me. i don't like pollution, litter or waste any more than anybody else.

How is drawing people's attention to waste & its cost distracting them from it?

What 'real' issues dcoes it distract from, and how would you tackle them?

[teamsaint]

How is drawing people's attention to waste & its cost distracting them from it?

What 'real' issues dcoes it distract from, and how would you tackle them?

I did mention some other issues up thread. Therw are plenty more.

Governments seek to distract or deflect all the time, not only on pollution/ waste issues.

[jean]

But you haven't shown that this particular measure is a distraction at all, rather than a first step in reducing waste.

You appear to start from the assumption that no good could ever come from any government initiative.

[Anna]

It's not an issue of distraction - it's an EU Directive which England have been slow to adopt, you will have the charge introduced in October 2015 so I think that's fair warning rather than a distraction? <winky eye emoticom>

Republic of Ireland introduced it in 2002, their single-bag usage has droped by 90% and the profit from their levy (higher than the UK at 22cents - around 18p per bag) goes community organisations to fund environmental projects as it does in N. Ireland & Wales, the 5p charge in Wales & N. Ireland is not a tax on bags, their use in Wales has dropped by 81%.

In 2012 England the number of single-use carrier bags was 7.1 billion. Jean in particular may like to read Parliament's Plastic Bag Environmental Audit.http://www.publications.parliament.u.../861/86105.htm

[Beef Oven!]

I did mention some other issues up thread. Therw are plenty more.

Governments seek to distract or deflect all the time, not only on pollution/ waste issues.

Pure Bakuninian tosh! ;-)