Growing your own - is it worth it?

[doversoul1]

It's growth inhibitors I need. This morning I found one of the broad bean plants was taller than me and that is just UNACCEPTABLE!

Well, I am glad to know that I am not imagining this growth phenomenon. Three of my DWARF broad beans have grown taller than me. They have beans but not right up to the top. Yet.

[french frank]

In this case the growth inhibitors were a pair of scissors.

[umslopogaas]

#195 hedgehog. There's a lot to discuss here, perhaps too much for one post. I think the problem is not so much willfully ignoring directions and precautions as ignorance of the potentially serious consequences of doing so. It is certainly possible to misuse the safest product if you try hard enough, but to do so suggests to me that you just dont know what you are doing.

So what are we to do?

Either, allow people to do what they like because we live in a free society, but hold them responsible for the consequences, even though we can clearly see that those might include injury to innocent people?

Or, prohibit them from doing things they want and accept the screams of rage and possible loss of office at the next election, because the outraged will vote us out?

Or maybe, since we are British and good at finding the middle way, we put down some restrictions to the more extreme behavior, but allow more than the total restrictionists would allow? If we do that, what you have is the amateur pesticide market.

I suppose there is another point here. If people are using products inappropriately - and they do, as you say - it is because they assume that because they, the completely unqualified in the subject, are allowed to buy and use them, they must be perfectly safe. The same people would probably say that because it is safe to fill their car with petrol, they can also chuck a gallon on the bonfire to speed up the inferno. They certainly will, but probably at the cost of their eyebrows, if they are lucky.

And there are worse things than amateur pesticides available to any dimwit or malcontent. Last time I looked, you could buy caustic soda to clear your blocked drains. Now that is a dangerous product, I have some and have used it, but I know well what it can do to your clothes, or skin.

This is a very interesting subject, all thoughts welcome, I'm sure.

[hedgehog]

I think you should read this as a theory on paper that has no practical link with actual activities of honeybees. In reality, bees are not necessarily (probably unlikely to be) exposed to the two chemicals simultaneously. Also, if significant number of bees were affected, the production of honey would drop, which has not been the case as far as I am aware. If you find that there is less British honey available in recent years, that is because many British beekeepers have lost their bees. The widespread destruction of bee colonies in the UK and elsewhere is mainly the result of the combination of a disease caused by verroa and unusual or extreme winter weather.

Doversoul: as you probably know, many, many studies are linking in neonicotinoids as well - to hives weakened by diseases, verroa mites. Of course all the scientists involved in those studies are not doing the studies properly. They are probably related to the ones that are doing the climate change stuff. Or maybe, just maybe there might be a link.

The alarm is for the decrease in wild pollinators. Honey bees are bred, thus replenishing the dying stock, which is why honey can still be produced as well as pollination for agriculture. It's getting to be a pricy business though.

I'll stop now. I know organic farming is not a viable solution for agriculture on a large scale, but to say - or have us believe that pesticides, fungicides and herbicides are being used the world over in a safe way I think is being blind to a lot of evidence to the contrary.

umslopogaas: yes I realise that about harmful products - the differentiation I make is that between self harm (free to do so) and willful neglect of harm to surrounding wildlife and plants in order to get a few potatoes that taste marginally better than a blight resistant variety. There is so little habitat left that gardens and allotments have become very important to the survival of much wildlife.
I guess it's just naïf of me to think that people who grow stuff for pleasure actually care about nurturing the variety of insects, birds and etc. Perhaps not. I'm not British.

[umslopogaas]

#199 hedgehog, I dont at all think you are naif, many, perhaps most, of those who like to grow their own veg do so because they enjoy working with plants. Some of those who do are happy to use pesticides approved as safe, some are not. Some of the pro-pesticide folk and some of the antis probably both derive income from investments, which include money sunk into companies that produce pesticides. So, some are in the uncomfortable position of saying that I dont like the way you earn money but please keep at it because I depend on your success for my retirement income.

Oh well, I can sleep with contradictions, if there arent any more attractive ladies available.

[doversoul1]

In this case the growth inhibitors were a pair of scissors.

Oh, I can’t do that. I like to see them grow. Besides, one day, I might be able to climb up and find treasures…

[french frank]

Oh, I can’t do that. I like to see them grow. Besides, one day, I might be able to climb up and find treasures…

I did find treasures - I had them for my supper, with some beans as well. Dropped in boiling water for 2 minutes, then tossed in butter, with black perpper and consumed with two Ryvitas. The beans were lovely but the bean tops were a bit soggy, though edible, in a way.

[amateur51]

I did find treasures - I had them for my supper, with some beans as well. Dropped in boiling water for 2 minutes, then tossed in butter, with black perpper and consumed with two Ryvitas. The beans were lovely but the bean tops were a bit soggy, though edible, in a way.

I wonder if the bean tops might have been better if they'd been rinsed and shaken once and then microwaved for a minute, in the first instance?

Whaddayamean you haven't got a microwave? In Bristle they're called Miklewaves

[Madame Suggia]

Terribly late I know but I'm just putting lettuces, courgette and tomato plants into grow bags

..although they don't sell grow bags in France.

[french frank]

Terribly late I know but I'm just putting lettuces, courgette and tomato plants into grow bags

..although they don't sell grow bags in France.

Lettuces are all right - you can go on sowing them for a bit. Don't know about courgettes, probably a bit late. Tomatoes, hmmm, don't know what your climate's like but if the fruit come too late they don't ripen. But you can make green tomato chutney with them :-)

Amsy, no, I don't ... not by any name.

[doversoul1]

I did find treasures - I had them for my supper, with some beans as well. Dropped in boiling water for 2 minutes, then tossed in butter, with black perpper and consumed with two Ryvitas. The beans were lovely but the bean tops were a bit soggy, though edible, in a way.

If the tops are tender enough, they might be better fried in butter with salt and pepper, and maybe a few chopped up parsley or marjoram. I have too many normal vegetables to try any deviations / experiment.

[french frank]

If the tops are tender enough, they might be better fried in butter with salt and pepper, and maybe a few chopped up parsley or marjoram. I have too many normal vegetables to try any deviations / experiment.

Yes, I nearly added that - wilted like spinach. I just didn't fancy the beans like that. I have too few vegetables. I shall be tired of broad beans soon, and then I shall get tired of runner beans (but not of peas!). Sometimes I wonder whether Growing My Own is worth it ...

[umslopogaas]

The latest New Scientist has a piece on neonicotinoid insecticides which isnt reassuring. (no.2975, page 6). The latest study, from Utrecht University, says that they break down more slowly than previous studies suggested, and therefore they may accumulate to more dangerous levels than previously thought.

Despite a two year moratorium on their use within the EU, they apparently make up almost one third of insecticides used (globally, presumably), so if they are shown to be unsafe, and withdrawn, that will be a serious loss.

Meanwhile, on a more positive note, my peas are just beginning and it looks like a good harvest.

[vinteuil]

Sometimes I wonder whether Growing My Own is worth it ...

... some time back, helping some friends prune a vine trailing over a pergola, I was overheard to mutter "If I want grapes, I go to Waitrose; if I want wine I go to the Wine Society... [mutter grumble grumble mutter] ... "

[amateur51]

... some time back, helping some friends prune a vine trailing over a pergola, I was overheard to mutter "If I want grapes, I go to Waitrose; if I want wine I go to the Wine Society... [mutter grumble grumble mutter] ... "

Attaboy vints

Are you still at the YMCA or is Casa Vints fit for human habitation once more?