***** web sites!

[Flosshilde]

I didn't realise that the South Bank and the Barbican still do free mailouts. If so, then I must subscribe again ASAP.

I think the rules about opting in/out for mailings changed a few years ago, & organisations sent out letters asking you to confirm that you still wanted mailings; if you didn't reply you were dropped from the mailing list. I fell foul of that with a couple of organisations.

[teamsaint]

If I may just add some opinion.....I strongly suspect that the approach of organisations such as the Barbican and SBC to websites is rather symptomatic of the approach of arts organisations in general to marketing. This approach seems to be to be a rather half hearted thing, which involves producing some nice marketing publicity material (or online equivalent) and hoping quietly that customers buy tickets. This is a wholly inadequate approach IMO.
I had a little practical experience of this recently.
A job was advertised for a " Sales and Marketing Manager " for a small local arts venue. After a lifetime in sales, an understanding and a little experience of some aspects of marketing, and a passable interest in and working knowledge of various arts, (as well as a number of years in publishing) I thought I was reasonably qualified to apply.
When I got the" application pack", (for a position well below my salary at the time) it turned out that what they actually wanted was not somebody to apply hands on sales and marketing techniques, but somebody capable of quality desk top publishing....produce the brochure/website, and off you go. Wasn't "Sales and Marketing" at all IMO . Perhaps they have it right and I have it wrong.

[Ferretfancy]

As far as the Barbican and the South Bank goes, I get reams of bumf by post from both, detailing all I need to know. Most of the concert giving organisations also send out their own information as well, and that includes all the orchestras, so I don't really see a difficulty.

As for the website problem, I agree with Dave that they are really bad. The problem seems to be that administrators don't have any IT skills and are too trusting of the so called specialists who live in a weird world of their own to look after things.

An organisation that I support as a volunteer decided some time ago to have a sub set of its internal website just for its volunteers. This would provide information, training notes etc. So far, many of the volunteers have been unable to register, and months after its inception the site still isn't functioning properly
This seems all too common.

[Stillhomewardbound]

... and can someone tell me the justification for the booking fee. This add-on came about in the 80s when venues started outsourcing their box offices to ticket agencies, so where's the justification in a booking fee for a system that is all but fully automated with the purchaser selecting his own seats and processing his own payment. Often there's a mailing fee also which I can understand, except that it is usually 40% higher than the actual postage cost.

By the principle of the thing I'd have to call it dishonest pricing.

[Don Petter]

Re web sites, the people who create these often don't have a clue. They don't put themselves in the mind of the reader.

Not just that. They don't even run the simplest tests to check things out.


Example 1 yesterday:

'Choose password (must include at least one upper case letter)' - I input seven figures and two upper case letters
'Error! Password must include at least one lower case letter!'

Example 2 frequently:

'Enter card number, exactly as on card' - I enter it, with spaces, as shown and requested
'Error! Spaces are not allowed!' Why the hell not say 'no spaces' or just program them to be ignored. It's easy enough. I've written dozens of such input routines.


Rant over. I feel better.

[Petrushka]

Not just that. They don't even run the simplest tests to check things out.


Example 1 yesterday:

'Choose password (must include at least one upper case letter)' - I input seven figures and two upper case letters
'Error! Password must include at least one lower case letter!'

Example 2 frequently:

'Enter card number, exactly as on card' - I enter it, with spaces, as shown and requested
'Error! Spaces are not allowed!' Why the hell not say 'no spaces' or just program them to be ignored. It's easy enough. I've written dozens of such input routines.


Rant over. I feel better.

I come across this sort of thing quite a lot. There's one website I have to use at work which is a nightmare with passwords. The instructions are that the password must contain at least one upper case letter, one lower case letter, one numeral and one that is not alpha-numeric at all. In addition, it must be no less than 9 characters. You thus end up with something like this as an example: Y2gD+=Fy3. The problem is that I only need to go on the website every so often and the password will be invalid after say 6 weeks. If you fail to enter a new password before it expires then it will lock you out completely and you have to jump through several hoops to get it up and running again. The whole thing is very frustrating.

Wish I could name and shame them but better not. It's a very well known organisation that has out-sourced its accounting routine.

[Flosshilde]

The IT people (or whoever - managers with not enough to do) at my last place decided that our password for logging on to our user area had to be changed every month, & we couldn't re-use the same password within 12 (or was it 24?) months. Trying to come up with 12 (or 24) meaningful passwords was a nightmare, & inevitably resulted in some of them being very rude & uncomplimentary to the people who came up with the idea.

[Dave2002]

... and can someone tell me the justification for the booking fee. This add-on came about in the 80s when venues started outsourcing their box offices to ticket agencies, so where's the justification in a booking fee for a system that is all but fully automated with the purchaser selecting his own seats and processing his own payment. Often there's a mailing fee also which I can understand, except that it is usually 40% higher than the actual postage cost.

By the principle of the thing I'd have to call it dishonest pricing.

Some of it could be justified by the costs incurred in setting up the infrastructure and system. What really gets to me is those agencies which charge a booking fee per ticket. Some sites only charge per transaction, which is much more reasonable.

[Boilk]

The IT people (or whoever - managers with not enough to do) at my last place decided that our password for logging on to our user area had to be changed every month, & we couldn't re-use the same password within 12 (or was it 24?) months. Trying to come up with 12 (or 24) meaningful passwords was a nightmare, & inevitably resulted in some of them being very rude & uncomplimentary to the people who came up with the idea.

Very simple solution: keep the same password all year long but the first (or last) three characters would progress through: jan / feb / mar ... dec, so you never forget the static or dynamic bits of the password.

Related to this, I have the same 12-character password for almost every web site I visit ... and prefix it with two further letters unique (and meaningful) to that site. e.g. PayPal is "pp.....", Hotmail is "hm......." — and so on. That way I never forget the password and each one is unique.

[Dave2002]

bolik

So now all we need to do is to crack one of your passwords, and then, armed with a calendar and a list of web sites and applications you're busted!

[Petrushka]

Very simple solution: keep the same password all year long but the first (or last) three characters would progress through: jan / feb / mar ... dec, so you never forget the static or dynamic bits of the password.

Related to this, I have the same 12-character password for almost every web site I visit ... and prefix it with two further letters unique (and meaningful) to that site. e.g. PayPal is "pp.....", Hotmail is "hm......." — and so on. That way I never forget the password and each one is unique.

Regarding the website at work I mentioned above, I do something similar to this. I just change the last digit each time to the next one up. The real bugbear with it, though, is that the password expires inside 6 weeks or so and as I only need to visit it once, maybe twice, a month I frequently get caught out and locked out. The rigmarole of getting back on again is a real time waster and I need an administrator to do it for me.

[MrBear]

Been having real trouble using the Naxos direct website got some real good bargins from them this time last year so I will be spending my money elsewhere

Use to work for a very big company setting up up computer accounts and restting passwords we were real b*********s at times but one reason was to stop the company losing face being taken to court etc

Not been able to go to concerts for health reasons but hoping to soon apart from. Seffield University whos website is good once you know were to look I don't know how I going to find what I can and want to see

[Boilk]

I didn't realise that the South Bank and the Barbican still do free mailouts. If so, then I must subscribe again ASAP.

Dave, I stand corrected. I did a little research and got this reply from the Barbican:

Currently, we only mail out the monthly guide to Members, this is one of our key benefits so we are unable to extend it to other customers. All Members receive the monthly guide and Membership starts from just £20 a month [my highlighting], and you could also enjoy a range of other benefits (including 15% off in our restaurants and bars, 20% off film tickets and special Members events). You can find out more on our website: http://www.barbican.org.uk/membership/member-benefits

Alternatively, for an overview of events on our website, I would recommend checking the ‘festivals and seasons’ section of the individual artforms’ areas of the website (there are so many events, I realise it can be a bit overwhelming to scroll through our calendar).

So hardcopy monthly mailouts are no longer free, but I do get the occasional free mailout of events related to stuff I have recently attended (e.g. 20th century or contemporary concerts).

[Dave2002]

£20 a month

http://www.barbican.org.uk/membership

I suspected that one has to pay, but this is excessive at £240 per year. We effectively get forced to use the web sites whether we want to or not.

It's not clear whether South Bank membership also includes mail outs - http://www.southbankcentre.co.uk/sup...ecome-a-member - but at least it can be obtained for
£50 per year (fee of £65 - £!5 for direct debit payments).

I shall redouble my efforts to pick up the hard copy booklets whenever I pass through any location which provides them.

[Dave2002]

Regarding the website at work I mentioned above, I do something similar to this. I just change the last digit each time to the next one up. The real bugbear with it, though, is that the password expires inside 6 weeks or so and as I only need to visit it once, maybe twice, a month I frequently get caught out and locked out. The rigmarole of getting back on again is a real time waster and I need an administrator to do it for me.

Been there, done that. Often reusing previous passwords doesn't work either, which can be a pain, though I did hear of one site where if you waited long enough you could reuse the previous passwords in a sequence similar to the first time. It would probably violate an organisation's security policy to have a password for each month on an A4 sheet kept in a locked drawer.