Badgers in the garden

[Richard Tarleton]

By the way, have you ever seen a chicken pen after a fox has been in for fun? Bit bloody.

RM, foxes don't kill for fun. That is anthropomorphism. They kill for food. Normally, in the wild, if a predator is killing one prey item, any others in the vicinity are scarpering. The predator does not get the opportunity to kill them too. The situation wherein a group of prey species are unable to flee (e.g. from a chicken pen) simply does not occur in the wild, and the fox is not capable of rationalising the situation. The fox is programmed to kill as much as it can in order to provide against lean times (or to feed its young). The fault lies with whoever built the chicken pen.

BTW there is a charming Northern Ireland expression for a very wet day - "You wouldn't put a fox out of a hen run on a day like this"

[umslopogaas]

Interesting stuff. Neither foxes nor chickens are operating in their "natural" environment, and therefore, usual laws do not apply. Foxes are certainly predators and in our carefully maintained artificial rural environment, have no enemies except us. Chickens are not native to the UK, are entirely present by our consent, and are very attractive to foxes. Under those conditions, a chicken is a very attractive prey for a fox. This isnt anthropomorphism, it is straightforward animal opportunism.

If you want to keep your chickens away from the foxes, give them trees to roost in. But make sure they can fly, modern hens are not too keen on these outdoor pursuits. Better still, keep them inside at night. Foxes might be able to climb, but they cant yet undo padlocks.

[greenilex]

Ahinton: agreed that growing food for sale is a business like any other. Probably more vital than most.

It's just that my dichotomy is capitalist v. cooperator and best farming businessmen are cooperators not capitalists. They use their wealth to benefit their community, not to sit in a bank or fund global ambitions. And of course there are cuddly capitalists too but they need watching.

[doversoul1]

Sorry to dig up this old thread but I thought this looks an interesting book, although not as scholarly as one mentioned by umslopogaas.

Badgerlands: The Twilight World of Britain's Most Enigmatic Animal by Patrick Barkham

Barkham also tries hard to get to see badgers in the wild, and it is his many failures to spot them that provide some the book's best moments. It is all so much more real than the carefully edited slices of life we see on sumptuously produced wildlife programmes

http://www.theguardian.com/books/2013/sep/27/badgerlands-patrick-barkham-review

[Anna]

According to the Environment Minister as to why the badger cull had not reached the targets, it appears the badgers have moved the goalposts!

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-24459424

Did they expect them to come out with their paws up?

(would like to read that Patrick Barkham book, at the mo I'm reading one of his about butterflies)

[jayne lee wilson]

You can rely on Coalition spokespersons to really gift you a quote can't you? THE BADGERS HAVE MOVED THE GOALPOSTS it's sheer joy just to write it down.
All the scientists' studies are wrong AND it's all the badgers' fault! Nasty neutral scientists and nasty dirty cunning wild animals!

This is exactly what I warned of earlier in this thread - that whatever happened the Government would claim success. The truth doesn't matter with this Americanised Foxnews Neoliberal politics. I remember Dick Cheney once referring to an antiRepublican New York journalist as "one of those reality-based guys"... now we've got the disease here and THAT's what needs culling.

[Barbirollians]

Oh and of course they are not testing the badgers they have killed for TB - we don't want the public to know of the hundreds of healthy badgers killed do we ?

[Mr Pee]

[scottycelt]

[Richard Tarleton]

Indeed. A perfect example of what Matt does best - fusing two unrelated news stories together to brilliant effect.

[subcontrabass]

THE BADGERS HAVE MOVED THE GOALPOSTS

Try: http://toys.usvsth3m.com/owen-paters...alty-shootout/

[Mr Pee]

Try: http://toys.usvsth3m.com/owen-paters...alty-shootout/

[Anna]

The Environment Minister, Owen Paterson, has said they may consider gassing the badgers (full article here)

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-24475034

Responding to a question from Green MP Caroline Lucas in the Commons, Mr Paterson said: "Until we can establish vaccines, we have to use the tools used by other sensible countries - which is to remove wildlife - we made it quite clear in our TB strategy we would look at other methods of removing wildlife, and yes we are looking at gassing, but we will not use it unless it is proven to be safe, humane, and effective."

In Wales they are vaccinating in trial areas (I believe Pembrokeshire) so vaccines do exist. And please Mr. Paterson, don't refer to them as 'wildlife' (which sounds like you are calling them scum of the earth), they do have a name ....

Meanwhile, the RSPB, who oppose the badger cull, had this on their website re the dangers of extending the cull:

Shooting less than the target number increases the risk of making the bovine TB situation worse by stirring up the badger population (perturbation). The reason for limiting the culls to six weeks was because the science behind culling tells us that culling should be simultaneous across the cull zone. Extending the shooting over a long period is known to increase the risk of perturbation, therefore making the TB situation worse! Just to be specific about this the advice on the duration of culling came from Defra’s Science Advisory Council and Bovine Science Advisory Body (the Joint Group) and it was that culling should extend to ‘no longer than 4-6 weeks’. So we do not see that extending the cull to 9 weeks can be based on science - something that the coalition agreement stated as the precondition for any cull.
We shouldn’t forget that there will be farmers just outside the cull zones who will no doubt be worried sick that they will be at increased risk of a devastating TB outbreak in their herd as a result of an ineffective cull.

[jayne lee wilson]

Try: http://toys.usvsth3m.com/owen-paters...alty-shootout/

I took three penalties... and scored with the third!
(1 - Badger saves. 2) Missed the goal)

The Coalition's strikers don't know where the goal is.

[Mr Pee]

Now this is a good idea.:-

http://www.thedailymash.co.uk/news/environment/struggling-badger-cull-may-switch-to-cats-2013101080245?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+thedailymash+%28The+Daily+Mash.+It%27s+news+to+us.%29&utm_content=Netvibes

And just think of the benefits to our garden birds and other wildlife......