The Ashes 2013

[mercia]

have we stopped retaining the Ashes ? oh good, the responsibility was praying on my mind.

[Pabmusic]

have we stopped retaining the Ashes ? oh good, the responsibility was praying on my mind.

Sorry Mercia, but we haven't stopped retaining the Ashes. We still have them.

[mercia]

Sorry Mercia, but we haven't stopped retaining the Ashes. We still have them.

ah, but now we've won them. the temporary in limbo retaining is over [I think you'll find]

[Pabmusic]

ah, but now we've won them. the temporary in limbo retaining is over [I think you'll find]

But doesn't 'retain' mean in effect 'keep hold of'? Which we were doing already from the last Ashes series. I'm becoming confused now.

[On further thought] I suppose we no longer retain them just because the Aussies couldn't win them. We retain them because we've actually won the series.

[mercia]

you're probably right pab. Ignore me, I'm being deliberately supercilious, as is my wont.

[Pabmusic]

you're probably right pab. I'm being deliberately supercilious, as is my wont.

Hoo nose.

[Sir Velo]

ah, but now we've won them. the temporary in limbo retaining is over [I think you'll find]

I'm afraid you're wrong there mercia. We haven't won the Ashes since 2009.

[mercia]

I'm sure we've won something. am51 said so.

[Sir Velo]

I'm sure we've won something. am51 said so.

Well, if Ams said so....

We've won the series, but not The Ashes.

The Ashes were won in 2009, and have not been relinquished since - only retained (q.v.).

[Mr Pee]

Well, if Ams said so....

The Ashes were won in 2009, and have not been relinquished since - only retained (q.v.).

Pedant....

[mercia]

I see. So, for winning the series, are we presented with anything ? if so, what ?

This must be a unique concept in sporting competitions. e.g. when Roger Federer beat Andy Roddick in the final of Wimbledon 2004, did we say he was retaining the championship or winning it (for a second consecutive year) ?

I don't see why so much was made of us retaining the Ashes at the end of the 3rd test, when we are still merely retaining them at the end of the 4th.

let me know if I'm boring you

[Sir Velo]

I see. So, for winning the series, are we presented with anything ? if so, what ?

An urn.

I don't see why so much was made of us retaining the Ashes at the end of the 3rd test, when we are still merely retaining them at the end of the 4th.

Without wishing to be too pedantic (pace Mr Pee ): in cricketing circles it has been traditional to refer to teams holding the Ashes, as in Australia held The Ashes from 1989 to 2005. This is to cover those series which may be drawn (e.g. 1-1; 2-2; etc) - something which isn't possible at Wimbledon, or in the Premier League, for example, where you have to have an outright winner. In these instances the Ashes are said to be retained by the team which held them at the start of the series. Hence, after the Old Trafford test, Australia could only have drawn the series and because the Ashes were held by England (by virtue of winning the 09 series 2-1; and the 10-11 series 3-1) it was impossible for the Ashes to go back to Australia. However, as England have now won the Durham test to go 3-0 up, they have won the series. This has no impact on their holding The Ashes, however.

[aka Calum Da Jazbo]

we have not lost The Ashes!

[mercia]

thank you for your patience and understanding - while I'm here, what is the point of going ahead with the fifth test ?

[aka Calum Da Jazbo]

we will not lose the Series