Zimerman walks off because "..You Tube is destroying Music"

[antongould]

Apologies if this has been raised elsewhere but it seems from today's Grauniad that on Monday evening Krystian Zimerman walked off in the middle of a performance of Szymanowski's Variations on a Polish Theme in B Minor because a member of the audience was filming him on a mobile phone.

[amateur51]

Good for him. You can't walk around an art gallery in London these days without some noodle letting off a flash on their phone or camera,which is then reflected in every piece of glass in the vicinity, ruining it for others.

It must be infuriating when you're in mid-flow to discover that some twerp is filming your recital. The late great Richard Griffiths used to stop in mid-flow and berate mobile phone users in the theatre.

Behave why don't you!

[mercia]

KZ seemed to be more concerned about possible loss of income

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-22780812

[french frank]

KZ seemed to be more concerned about possible loss of income
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-22780812

Yes, the pros and cons of YouTube.

[scottycelt]

Good for him. You can't walk around an art gallery in London these days without some noodle letting off a flash on their phone or camera,which is then reflected in every piece of glass in the vicinity, ruining it for others.

It must be infuriating when you're in mid-flow to discover that some twerp is filming your recital. The late great Richard Griffiths used to stop in mid-flow and berate mobile phone users in the theatre.

Behave why don't you!

Amsey, you old reactionary you, follow your fellow-liberal Mr GG's constant advice and stop living in the 1950's!

The world has moved on ... mobile phone users must have equal rights to non-mobile phone users and sod those (including well-paid, self-absorbed performers) who don't like it! The world isn't about to end, definitions of what is acceptable are an ever-changing process.

You Tube is one of the best (and free) ways now to build a good classical collection and I find anyone who dares to criticise this fine facility to be deeply offensive.

[ahinton]

Amsey, you old reactionary you, follow your fellow-liberal Mr GG's constant advice and stop living in the 1950's!

The world has moved on ... mobile phone users must have equal rights to non-mobile phone users and sod those (including well-paid, self-absorbed performers) who don't like it! The world isn't about to end, definitions of what is acceptable are an ever-changing process.

You Tube is one of the best (and free) ways now to build a good classical collection and I find anyone who dares to criticise this fine facility to be deeply offensive.

Then you find me so. I have recently had YouTube take down hundreds of items that infringe copyright. I don't like doing this kind of thing and fully support "fair use" uploads of short extracts of pieces but, when whole tracks of entire works or even entire CDs are uploaded, the sales of the CD concerned drop away and royalties therefrom do likewise. Yes, YouTube is indeed a great facility, as long as it's not abused which, more often than not, it is.

[Thropplenoggin]

Then you find me so. I have recently had YouTube take down hundreds of items that infringe copyright. I don't like doing this kind of thing and fully support "fair use" uploads of short extracts of pieces but, when whole tracks of entire works or even entire CDs are uploaded, the sales of the CD concerned drop away and royalties therefrom do likewise. Yes, YouTube is indeed a great facility, as long as it's not abused which, more often than not, it is.

I read somewhere that statistics don't actually support this and that sales are boosted by free downloads, as counter-intuitive as this sounds. It is certainly true in my own case, whereby I will sample in the first instance, either legally and free (Spotify), illegally and free (YouTube), or legally and paid for (Qobuz), and will then go on to buy the CD. In fact, since having two laptops die on me, both with lots of purloined tracks (I was in Vietnam where the ability to buy music was extremely restricted ), I have gone back to buying hard copies of music. I have now bought more CDs in the past few years, since becoming a classical music devotee, than I have in the previous 20!

[scottycelt]

Then you find me so. I have recently had YouTube take down hundreds of items that infringe copyright. I don't like doing this kind of thing and fully support "fair use" uploads of short extracts of pieces but, when whole tracks of entire works or even entire CDs are uploaded, the sales of the CD concerned drop away and royalties therefrom do likewise. Yes, YouTube is indeed a great facility, as long as it's not abused which, more often than not, it is.

I feel certain there might be a hefty majority of the population who would keep YT exactly as it is, ahinton, and as you have reminded us many times before majority opinion must hold sway!

[ahinton]

I read somewhere that statistics don't actually support this and that sales are boosted by free downloads, as counter-intuitive as this sounds. It is certainly true in my own case, whereby I will sample in the first instance, either legally and free (Spotify), illegally and free (YouTube), or legally and paid for (Qobuz), and will then go on to buy the CD. In fact, since having two laptops die on me, both with lots of purloined tracks (I was in Vietnam where the ability to buy music was extremely restricted ), I have gone back to buying hard copies of music. Indeed, I have now bought more CDs in the past few years, since becoming a classical music devotee, than I have in the previous 20!

Well, sadly I have statistics collected over several years that look as though they prove adverse effects on CD sales; I also know that illicitly uploaded scores screw sales of those gravely. The tiny handful of items of illicitly uploaded material that encourage their downloaders to go buy the whole thing is very much the exception.

[ahinton]

I feel certain there might be a hefty majority of the population who would keep YT exactly as it is, ahinton, and as you have reminded us many times before majority opinion must hold sway!

But YT's usually pretty good about taking items down that infringe copyright, as I have found; it would simply be better were YT to adopt a policy similar to that of Naxos in such matters because, whilst they also don;t go seeking permissions from copyright owners, they do at least make appropriate returns and pay for what they make available. As to that "majority opinion", it is merely something of which, as you yourself admit, you "feel certain"!...

[Thropplenoggin]

AH: As I said, I read this in a national newspaper (no great guarantor of reliability, I know), so it's not just my anecdotal evidence.

Here's one recent study: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-21856720

[ahinton]

AH: As I said, I read this in a national newspaper (no great guarantor of reliability, I know), so it's not just my anecdotal evidence.

I didn't suggest, nor do I suspect, that it was merely your own anecdotal evidence or indeed that you've taken what you've read in such a newspaper as gospel, but it stands to reason that people who can get whole CDs for free on YouTube will mostly prefer to do that rather than pay to purchase their own copies of the real thing.

[Thropplenoggin]

I didn't suggest, nor do I suspect, that it ws merely your own anecdotal evidence or indeed that you've taken what you;ve read in such a newspaper as gospel, but it stands to reason that people who can get whole CDs for free on YouTube will mostly prefer to do that rather than pay to purchase their own copies of the real thing.

See above link.

[ahinton]

See above link.

I have done and thank you indeed for posting it; I note from it, as you doubtless also do, that it's hardly a view set in stone that such uploads for free download do no damage to anyone.

The problem that I have found, not only (or even so much) in illegal uploads of recordings for free download but in those of music scores for the same, is that they have helped indirectly to create an environment in which many people have felt able to persuade themselves that they have some kind of divine right to obtain such material gratis, irrespective of the time, effort and money that have been invented in making it so that someone could upload it for free download.

[Thropplenoggin]

I have done and thank you indeed for posting it; I note from it, as you doubtless also do, that it's hardly a view set in stone that such uploads for free download do no damage to anyone.

The problem that I have found, not only (or even so much) in illegal uploads of recordings for free download but in those of music scores for the same, is that they have helped indirectly to create an environment in which many people have felt able to persuade themselves that they have some kind of divine right to obtain such material gratis, irrespective of the time, effort and money that have been invented in making it so that someone could upload it for free download.

A very fair point you make regarding the mindset it can create, AH. I now see that even fiction authors are being hurt by e-piracy on Kindles and such.

The article, in typical BBC fashion, has a sensational headline, then bends over backwards to give the other side in favour of some obsession with 'balance'. It ends up reading like a piece Kafka might have penned.