Grammar test for would-be pedants

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

I can't find the questions

Click on the red word "this" in SirV's first post. It will take you to a site with the heading "10 Questions on Grammar"; immediately below this, there's a light blue box, also with the title "10 Questions on Grammar", along the bottom line of which it says "Score 0 out of 10". To the left of this is an arrow: > click on this arrow and it takes you to the first question. We don't get to see a list of questions, just each one at a time.


8/10 for me.

[french frank]

ff How can you of all people possibly not get the "that/which" one? It's as clear as day!

As Schnabel said of Mozart: too easy for children, too difficult for artists

[Serial_Apologist]

Gosh - got 'em all right except "was sat". I'm sure the "correct" answer there is wrong!

[Frances_iom]

Gosh - got 'em all right except "was sat". I'm sure the "correct" answer there is wrong!

just google "was sat"

[french frank]

ff How can you of all people possibly not get the "that/which" one? It's as clear as day!

I'd draw your attention to the preamble to the questions:

"Of course, there are no official rules for English. Everything that follows is debatable."

(And, by the way, should that be 'everything which follows'?)

Not everything in the quiz is debatable, but several points are. As for 'which' and 'that', the 'official' reply is too dogmatic: in a defining clause either which or that is permissible (Gowers says, 'but that is to be preferred'. and 'On the whole it makes for smoothness of writing not to use the relative which where that would do as well.'). The question says "Sometimes you should use "that" and sometimes "which". Which sentence here is wrong?"

The answer is that none of them is wrong, but you can't proceed with the quiz until you've chosen one. Mr Gove set this.

[Serial_Apologist]

just google "was sat"

http://www.mumsnet.com/Talk/pedants_corner/a1446589-I-was-sat-is-incorrect

[teamsaint]

I have never been on Mumsnet before.

Is it supposed to be scary, or is it like that by chance? Is the government behind it. I bet they are.

[mangerton]

I've just done this quiz, and I too am a guru with 10/10. It's probably an age thing. At primary school in the fifties and early sixties, each day started the in the same way, with prayers, spelling from Schonell's books, mental arithmetic, and written arithmetic. In English we were taught analysis and parsing. When in secondary school we started French and Latin, we knew about subjects and objects. It must be difficult for teachers of foreign languages nowadays, faced with pupils who don't have a grounding in English grammar.

By the way, you may not know why "gurus" are so called. At first, there were very few of them, but quite soon their numbers just guru and guru.

(I'm wearing my coat; it's still damn cold up here. That, btw, is how I was taught to use a semicolon, not that I'm saying for a moment that other ways are wrong.)

[Mary Chambers]

I still don't get it. I disagree with their conclusion. But who am I to say?

I can see what they mean, but I got it wrong, too. 9/10, and I'm horrified! I confidently expected full marks.

[Sir Velo]

That, btw, is how I was taught to use a semicolon, not that I'm saying for a moment that other ways are wrong.

Isn't a semicolon missing from that sentence?

[french frank]

Isn't a semicolon missing from that sentence?

And that's exactly what's wrong with this kind of 'only one correct answer' test .

In the end, as long as the writer understands the basics of punctuation, it's up to them to decide the nuance of meaning they want to convey. Since the standard usage is understood, punctuation comes to have shades of meaning and it's not invariably wrong if the writer chooses a semi colon rather than a comma or a colon rather than a semi colon: there isn't a 'right' answer to that (as the quiz preamble states).

[teamsaint]

And that's exactly what's wrong with this kind of 'only one correct answer' test .

In the end, as long as the writer understands the basics of punctuation, it's up to them to decide the nuance of meaning they want to convey. Since the standard usage is understood, punctuation comes to have shades of meaning and it's not invariably wrong if the writer chooses a semi colon rather than a comma or a colon rather than a semi colon: there isn't a 'right' answer to that (as the quiz preamble states).

I wonder if your very reasonable summary is one employed by the "designers" and markers for the new Key Stage 2 SATS which were taken for the first time today, (or whatever they are now called).

[french frank]

I wonder if your very reasonable summary is one employed by the "designers" and markers for the new Key Stage 2 SATS which were taken for the first time today, (or whatever they are now called).

I'm not sure at what stage children cease to want the answer and are interested in exploring possibilities.

[teamsaint]

I'm not sure at what stage children cease to want the answer and are interested in exploring possibilities.

very early, I would say, as an amateur.
What the children want probably doesn't really matter. The system seems designed to fit the needs of government ministers, and to stop teachers from doing anything creative.

The poetry that I have seen produced by children from "mixed ability" classes in junior schools is amazing. Their grammar and punctuation, even when well taught and executed, tends to be less inspiring !!

[LeMartinPecheur]

Missed out on Hilary too, but that could be because we're now of course in Trinity