University Challenge

[Eine Alpensinfonie]

There is no reason why the odd question may not relate to Classics a subject really only taught in places such as Latymer Upper School but last night's questions were absurd.

That is neither the fault of Latymer Upper School, nor Oxbridge.
On U.C. the students are asked questions about classical music and then we complain about it when the students cannot answer them.

[Mary Chambers]

Education doesn't consist of only what is learnt at school. There is always the possibility of learning by reading those useful things called books - or even the Internet. I didn't do Greek at school, but I have managed to pick up a bit about it all the same. We did do Latin and Ancient History, and I think it's a pity Latin (a very useful subject) isn't more widely taught now.

Scientists often complained in the past that there were no science questions on UC. That has changed. The questions are really very varied indeed, and general knowledge is just that - general.

[french frank]

I do not disparage the learning of those subjects at all . What I was criticising is that University Challenge that does not provide for a level playing field.

It could be a fair yet very intellectually challenging quiz - shows like last night's are not fair .

I don't understand why this was not a level playing field. I thought you said both teams looked unrepresentative, public school educated ('unless one had been to a public school , which by the look and sound of them the vast majority of both of those teams had'). Do you mean there are always lots questions on Greek and Latin? (Btw, 'hapax legomenon' is a term of literary/textual criticism, not classics; and he pronounced it wrongly: he said 'hapax legonmenon')

[Mary Chambers]

I didn't have the impression that there were many questions on Greek and Latin last night. Knowing a Latin or Greek phrase used in English doesn't mean one has had a 'classical' education.

[Barbirollians]

Hapax legomenon is a Latin expression of an Ancient Greek term .

Yes they did both appear largely public school educated teams which I suppose in your eyes made it appropriate to have such weighted questions .

One almost might think some of the responses on this thread show that Roger Wright has a point about the Friends of Radio 3 and members of this forum .

[jean]

Hapax legomenon is a Latin expression of an Ancient Greek term

It's a Greek term - Latin doesn't enter into it, except that that's a transliteration.

I've never seen it used of modern languages, though; we do have words of which only a single use is recorded, but we usually know that somebody invented them, and what their inventors intended them to mean. There aren't many modern examples like κεχαριτωμένη, which could set off a whole theological debate.

[Mary Chambers]

Hapax legomenon is a Latin expression of an Ancient Greek term .

Yes they did both appear largely public school educated teams which I suppose in your eyes made it appropriate to have such weighted questions .

One almost might think some of the responses on this thread show that Roger Wright has a point about the Friends of Radio 3 and members of this forum .

Are you implying that only those educated in public schools would know those words? I don't think that's the case. I do acknowledge that last night's teams appeared to be largely ex-public school boys, though I haven't actually checked most of them. Perhaps people from that background are more competitive or more confident - I don't know.

What about all the scientific questions last night (far too many for me)? Or the history, literature or music ones? Do they favour people who went to public schools? Surely not. They were appropriate questions for anyone in higher education.

What kind of questions would you consider appropriate for UC nowadays? I am genuinely curious about this.

[jean]

When I was young, there were lots of people from state schools in University Classics departments. Now there are hardly any.

I thinnk that's sad.

[french frank]

Hapax legomenon is a Latin expression of an Ancient Greek term .

No, it's not Latin. It's a Greek term ἅπαξ λεγόμενον = 'once said', transliterated.

Yes they did both appear largely public school educated teams which I suppose in your eyes made it appropriate to have such weighted questions .

I have no opinion on the matter. I didn't see the programme. I just saw the video clip on the Evening Standard page. I thought you were saying that only public school educated students would know Latin and Greek, and that both teams appeared to be public school educated. So I didn't understand why it wasn't a level playing field if both sides had the same advantage.

One almost might think some of the responses on this thread show that Roger Wright has a point about the Friends of Radio 3 and members of this forum .

Could I repeat, I was asking you what YOU meant. Remind me, what was Roger Wright's point about the Friends of Radio 3?

[gurnemanz]

When I was young, there were lots of people from state schools in University Classics departments. Now there are hardly any.

I thinnk that's sad.

I taught modern languages at a comprehensive in the 80s and as a kind of experiment some First Years (year 7) were taught Latin. I found myself drafted in to teach a class - on the flimsy basis of having passed O level. The course was based on the everyday life of a typical Roman family with 2.4 children and a canem. It was great fun and the children seemed to enjoy it. The experiment didn't last very long, but I think some did take it through to O Level.

[Mary Chambers]

The Magdalen captain, Hugh Binnie, went to a state grammar school, apparently.

[MrGongGong]

The Magdalen captain, Hugh Binnie, went to a state grammar school, apparently.

There are state schools and "state schools"
NOT that i'm dissing any of them at all (seriously)

[teamsaint]

The Magdalen captain, Hugh Binnie, went to a state grammar school, apparently.

salisbury has state grammar schools, one each for boys and girls.

There is no almost no secondary private school provision for boys in Salisbury.

I"ll leave you to draw your own conclusions about the social mix at the boys grammar.

[Mary Chambers]

There are state schools and "state schools"

NOT that i'm dissing any of them at all (seriously)

Indeed - and it's in Cheltenham. Still not a public school, though!

[MrGongGong]

Indeed - and it's in Cheltenham. Still not a public school, though!

Angels on pinheads spring to mind