Gay marriage thread

[Flosshilde]

Well, a heterosexual couple are a 'natural' and clearly the most apt substitute ... like a knife and a fork are a natural substitute for a knife and a fork rather than a knife and a knife or a fork and a fork, or for that matter a single knife or single fork?

Don't you agree?

Forks are a relatively recent invention - in the past 400 - 500 years. Before them people used to use a knife & their fingers. Some people still use just their fingers, and bread, or just use chopsticks. Apparently the Queen uses two forks to eat fish. Many people in the USA use a knife to cut up their food into pieces before using a fork to convey it to their mouth.

Before you try using an analogy, Scotty, it would be as well to check that it holds water. Your cutlery (or flatware for USA readers) analogy just demonstrates that there is a huge variety in what might be considered 'natural'.

[scottycelt]

Well, mine has lasted 51 years so far and counting. A few threads ago, ( it seems a lifetime ! ) I recorded the fact that according to 2011 statistics on civil partnerships, only 2% of male partnerships have ended in official dissolution, and 4% of female partnerships. Of course, the figure will rise, as the earliest civil partnerships were only at the end of 2005, but nevertheless it's an indicator of success. Again, there are no figures for the duration of gay relationships in general, but there is no reason to suppose that they are briefer than heterosexual ones.

It would seem that the sad stereotype of the limp wristed fairy flitting from branch to branch is still seen as the true image by some of the sexual dinosaurs on this board.

The mind truly boggles, Ferret ... sexual dinosaurs on this forum, eh?


Now, I'm not really a great one for bandying statistics around, as I tend to agree with Disraeli's view of them, but from where did you get your figures?

According to the official statistics, there was a provisional number of 6795 CPs in 2011 and 672 dissolutions. You don't have to be a mathematician to work out that this dissolution percentage works out just shy of 10%. That hardly tallies with your separate figures for men and women.?

You are correct that the dissolution figure will almost certainly rise steadily in the next few years as there was a 6.4% increase in CPs compared to 2010 but a whopping 28.7% rise in dissolutions!

http://www.ons.gov.uk/ons/rel/vsob2/civil-partnership-statistics--united-kingdom/2011/sb-civil-partnerships-in-the-uk--2011.html

Just on a point of accuracy, you understand ...

[MrGongGong]

The mind truly boggles, Ferret ... sexual dinosaurs on this forum, eh?

This is rubbish
there were no dinosaurs
God put the so called "fossils" there to try and trick us into thinking that the earth was old .................
(no where are my golden tablets ? I'm sure I left them round here somewhere ?)

[Flosshilde]

Anyone for a life-long union?

I let my membership of UNISON lapse when I retired.

[MrGongGong]

I let my membership of UNISON lapse when I retired.

Did you discover polyphony ?

[Julien Sorel]

According to the official statistics, there was a provisional number of 6795 CPs in 2011 and 672 dissolutions. You don't have to be a mathematician to work out that this dissolution percentage works out just shy of 10%. That hardly tallies with your separate figures for men and women.?

It would work out as "just shy of 10%" if the 672 dissolutions were taken from the 6795 civil partnerships entered into in 2011. But that's not what it says.

Indeed: More than 100,000 people have now entered a civil partnership in Britain since they first became legal in December 2005. The 106,834 people far exceeds initial official estimates that between 11,000 and 22,000 would make the commitment in the first five years. http://www.guardian.co.uk/lifeandsty...pected-figures

[scottycelt]

It would work out as "just shy of 10%" if the 672 dissolutions were taken from the 6795 civil partnerships entered into in 2011. But that's not what it says.

Well obviously not but the rate of dissolution compared to new 'formations' is just short of 10% for the year 2011?

That's what it says.

[Julien Sorel]

Latest statistics (published December 2012) estimate that 42% of marriages in England and Wales end in divorce.

34% of marriages are expected to end in divorce by the 20th wedding anniversary.

The percentage of marriages ending in divorce increases more rapidly in the first 10 years of marriage than the 10 years after that.

http://www.ons.gov.uk/ons/rel/vsob1/divorces-in-england-and-wales/2011/sty-what-percentage-of-marriages-end-in-divorce.html

[Deckerd]

Well obviously not but the rate of dissolution compared to new 'formations' is just short of 10% for the year 2011?

That's what it says.

What precisely are you attempting to prove from this?

[scottycelt]

What precisely are you attempting to prove from this?

I'm not attempting to 'prove' anything. I'm simply querying Ferret's 2011 figures compared to the lot that I've discovered.

Have you queried Ferret, Julien and the 'firing on all cylinders' Ams exactly what they are trying to 'prove' with their posting of statistics, or do you only approve of statistics that fit in with your own particular point of view?

[Deckerd]

I'm not actually interested in statistics. I'm merely wondering what bearing they have with this debate at all.

[scottycelt]

Many people in the USA use a knife to cut up their food into pieces before using a fork to convey it to their mouth..

Well observed, Flossie ... that must have been a really fascinating "watch".

Did you happen to notice many Yanks using a fork to cut up their food into little pieces and then a knife to convey it to their mouth ... ?

[Julien Sorel]

I'm not attempting to 'prove' anything. I'm simply querying Ferret's 2011 figures compared to the lot that I've discovered.

Have you queried Ferret, Julien and the 'firing on all cylinders' Ams exactly what they are trying to 'prove' with their posting of statistics, or do you only approve of statistics that fit in with your own particular point of view?

The statistics on divorce suggest it's a rather flimsy claim that different sex marriage is the only secure basis from which to bring up a child. No?

Here are some more statistics if you want them http://www.guardian.co.uk/news/datab...l-partnerships. Of course, it's far too soon to say whether civil partnerships or same sex marriages will prove more durable, less durable, or about as durable as different sex marriages (hopefully at some stage different sex civil partnerships will be introduced. Though I imagine the Catholic Church and the Church of England would lobby against that?)

[scottycelt]

I'm not actually interested in statistics. I'm merely wondering what bearing they have with this debate at all.

Well obviously some members here disagree with you so maybe you should take the matter up with them ... ?

[Deckerd]

Well obviously I was responding to you so maybe you should take the request on the chin and justify it ... ?