Playing with trains/ HS2 & 3

[Bryn]

Just received from a friend:

Jonathan Meades, on a Prime Minister near you:

“A once major power is led into nightmarish catastrophe and chaos by a journalist of sorts. A cruel mendacious antinomian narcissist, an aspirant dictator who revels in destruction (judicial powers, free speech, constitutional safeguards) having learnt the joys of destruction and ostentatious oafishness at, astonishingly, a seat of “learning”. The oaf’s only creation is a shivering, starving bedlam hidden by a policy of coarse populism, formerly trading as bread and circuses.”

[EnemyoftheStoat]

Shocking treatment of those in the path of the abandoned project t:

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2021/nov/18/can-we-have-our-home-back-hs2-u-turn-leaves-uprooted-family-reeling

[teamsaint]

Meanwhile, back on the important things, customer service on the railways brought 3 hard and reasonably enjoyable days work to a shuddering halt this evening, due to what can only be referred to as a numpty.
I had to get from Olympia to Clapham to catch the train to Andover , and rather wanted to get the last one before the gap went up to an hour. Its a breeze to do in the 45 mins I had, if the London Overground is running.
Which wasn’t. Replacement buses weren't going to do it, so I lugged my two heavy bags on the tube towards waterloo ( probably should have headed to Victoria). However, despite the tube lines accepting tickets, after a slog on “ crowded at pre pandemic level ” tubes, i got to the gate at Waterloo with a couple of minutes to spare. The person dealing with the gates was playing in a control box and not looking after customers , but refused to accept my ticket initially citing lack of instructions on the LO closure ( who really would bother to try to game this to get from Waterloo to Clapham?) before allowing me through , as the train doors slammed shut.
Absolute nonsense. And an hour wait.
Incredibly disappointing response from , as I say, somebody displaying numpty behaviour.

[Joseph K]

Meanwhile, back on the important things, customer service on the railways brought 3 hard and reasonably enjoyable days work to a shuddering halt this evening, due to what can only be referred to as a numpty.
I had to get from Olympia to Clapham to catch the train to Andover , and rather wanted to get the last one before the gap went up to an hour. Its a breeze to do in the 45 mins I had, if the London Overground is running.
Which wasn’t. Replacement buses weren't going to do it, so I lugged my two heavy bags on the tube towards waterloo ( probably should have headed to Victoria). However, despite the tube lines accepting tickets, after a slog on “ crowded at pre pandemic level ” tubes, i got to the gate at Waterloo with a couple of minutes to spare. The person dealing with the gates was playing in a control box and not looking after customers , but refused to accept my ticket initially citing lack of instructions on the LO closure ( who really would bother to try to game this to get from Waterloo to Clapham?) before allowing me through , as the train doors slammed shut.
Absolute nonsense. And an hour wait.
Incredibly disappointing response from , as I say, somebody displaying numpty behaviour.

Sorry to hear this, TS. What my mum would call 'jobsworth' behaviour.

[Bryn]

Sorry to hear this, TS. What my mum would call 'jobsworth' behaviour.

My sympathies, too. However, to offer some balance, a few weeks ago I was struggling up the long ramp towards platforms 20 to 24 at Waterloo Station. I was dragging a heavy wheelie case full of recording equipment and using a Nordic walking pole to assist with the restricted mobility of my right leg. As I approached the barriers to the platforms, a railway employee staffing the gates opened one of the wide gates for me without any attempt to check my ticket or get me to run it through the gate's reader. I thanked him and he wished me a safe journey. I bet he had had a better day than the jobsworth encountered by teamsaint.

[teamsaint]

My sympathies, too. However, to offer some balance, a few weeks ago I was struggling up the long ramp towards platforms 20 to 24 at Waterloo Station. I was dragging a heavy wheelie case full of recording equipment and using a Nordic walking pole to assist with the restricted mobility of my right leg. As I approached the barriers to the platforms, a railway employee staffing the gates opened one of the wide gates for me without any attempt to check my ticket or get me to run it through the gate's reader. I thanked him and he wished me a safe journey. I bet he had had a better day than the jobsworth encountered by teamsaint.

I would say that service is mostly very good Bryn, and 'm glad that you had a good experience.

I was pretty astonished that ticket acceptance instructions hadn't reached Waterloo. The LO was closed from at least Olympia down to Clapham and Richmond. Either the instruction hadn't gone out to Waterloo, or my man hadn't been paying attention.
I suspect I would have been better hopping off the district at Victoria and taking a mainline to Clapham from there, which would have saved me the completely rammed Jubilee line. Not seen such packed trains in more than two years.
Grumble over :)

[cloughie]

I would say that service is mostly very good Bryn, and 'm glad that you had a good experience.

I was pretty astonished that ticket acceptance instructions hadn't reached Waterloo. The LO was closed from at least Olympia down to Clapham and Richmond. Either the instruction hadn't gone out to Waterloo, or my man hadn't been paying attention.
I suspect I would have been better hopping off the district at Victoria and taking a mainline to Clapham from there, which would have saved me the completely rammed Jubilee line. Not seen such packed trains in more than two years.
Grumble over :)

What time did you get home?

I see that on HS2 - the old pals network that in order not to upset the 1922 chair and his constituents the Transport Secretary has nodded that the HS2 link to the West Coast Main Line at Golbourne will not go ahead!

[teamsaint]

What time did you get home?

About 9.00, Cloughie. Left Olympia at 5.30

All in the cause of keeping the wheels of industry turning !!

[Serial_Apologist]

About 9.00, Cloughie. Left Olympia at 5.30

All in the cause of keeping the wheels of industry turning !!

Terrible - may I offer my sympathies, TS. If someone had offered the advice that I should have checked TfL's webgsite for closures I would have been tempted to deck that person, if only on the basis of the number of times I have done just that, only to find that closures have either not been registered on the site or have been imposed while I was on the way to catch the train.

[alywin]

I was pretty astonished that ticket acceptance instructions hadn't reached Waterloo. The LO was closed from at least Olympia down to Clapham and Richmond. Either the instruction hadn't gone out to Waterloo, or my man hadn't been paying attention.

Do they really send those instructions out any more? The last few times there's been a problem with my train lines and we've been told to use local buses instead, none of the bus drivers were aware that that was the case. I even had one driver force me to get off his bus because he wouldn't accept my rail ticket and I refused to pay twice over ... Why I would waste my time with a half-hour bus journey instead of a 10-minute train one if I didn't have to is anyone's guess.

[Petrushka]

Do they really send those instructions out any more? The last few times there's been a problem with my train lines and we've been told to use local buses instead, none of the bus drivers were aware that that was the case. I even had one driver force me to get off his bus because he wouldn't accept my rail ticket and I refused to pay twice over ... Why I would waste my time with a half-hour bus journey instead of a 10-minute train one if I didn't have to is anyone's guess.

Assuming you are referring to a rail replacement bus, my experience over many years was that the bus drivers did not check tickets as it was not their problem. We occasionally, but rarely, had train staff check tickets on the bus but usual thinking was that as travellers had already had enough hassle it was better not to give any more.

When Derby station had a two month major refurbishment in 2018, there were no trains in or out (except to/from London) and a comprehensive rail replacement service was provided. I never bought a ticket for the whole two months and neither did anyone else.

[Dave2002]

It's [perhaps] nice to live in an area where there are transport alternatives, and a good range of services. I now live in an area [fairly rural] where there are trains and buses, but many people travel by car. There is no joined up transport policy. If a train is late or cancelled, there is, AFAIK, no automatic right to get on a bus instead without having to pay an additional fare. OK - it doesn't affect me much as I have a bus pass, but there really ought to be tickets which work on both buses and trains - and at no or very little extra cost. It wouldn't work in some areas because there may be places where there aren't railway stations, or possibly no bus services.

I don't think that politicians really care about integrated transport policies.

[oddoneout]

Assuming you are referring to a rail replacement bus, my experience over many years was that the bus drivers did not check tickets as it was not their problem. We occasionally, but rarely, had train staff check tickets on the bus but usual thinking was that as travellers had already had enough hassle it was better not to give any more.

When Derby station had a two month major refurbishment in 2018, there were no trains in or out (except to/from London) and a comprehensive rail replacement service was provided. I never bought a ticket for the whole two months and neither did anyone else.

It will depend on whether the buses are genuine "rail replacement"ones, ie organised by the train company, or said company simply saying that passengers will have to use existing bus services, but not having a formal arrangement with whatever company/ies run them? In the latter case I would think the bus drivers have no proof that the journey required will be paid for if a rail ticket is accepted instead, and it will be seen as their fault for allowing passengers on. For unscheduled "no train" situations I rather doubt that the systems exist to immediately notify all the relevant bus companies and, more importantly the drivers, and then sort out the reimbursement to the companies. I have twice encountered emergency-caused disruptions and in both cases local coach companies were called on by the rail company direct, so no need for passengers to bother about whether their rail tickets would be accepted (unless they chose/had to use an alternative), since they were shepherded onto the right vehicles by rail staff. On the second occasion the need for many to catch flights meant that taxis and minibuses were called instead and sorting out repayment would have to be dealt with later. I have had to use scheduled rail replacement buses on two occasions in the past few years(I avoid travelling at weekends as far as possible to avoid the non-train issue - paying rail prices for a bus is wrong as far as I'm concerned) and the tickets were checked at the station where the bus was the first stage for the first, and on the train travelling to the station that was the end point for the second.

[alywin]

Assuming you are referring to a rail replacement bus, my experience over many years was that the bus drivers did not check tickets as it was not their problem. We occasionally, but rarely, had train staff check tickets on the bus but usual thinking was that as travellers had already had enough hassle it was better not to give any more.

No, I was referring to the standard (London) bus services. It used to be that you'd be on a bus and hear an "attention all mobiles - there's been a [problem] on the XYZ train line and passengers are to be passed on buses nos. ..."-type message. Now, what seems to happen is that at the station someone announces that there's been an incident between X and Y stations so there are no trains until further notice, and passengers will be passed on local buses. Except that nobody seems to bother to tell the bus drivers any more :(

[oddoneout]

No, I was referring to the standard (London) bus services. It used to be that you'd be on a bus and hear an "attention all mobiles - there's been a [problem] on the XYZ train line and passengers are to be passed on buses nos. ..."-type message. Now, what seems to happen is that at the station someone announces that there's been an incident between X and Y stations so there are no trains until further notice, and passengers will be passed on local buses. Except that nobody seems to bother to tell the bus drivers any more :(

Ironic given the ease with which, in theory, such information can be disseminated these days, so that the first passengers to present with the expectation of ticket exemption should flag up the need to check for messages from HQ? The old version had the advantage I suppose of not needing the driver to do anything other than hear the message, and so be forewarned.