Plebs 1 Toffs 0

[ahinton]

Thanks helio.

AH will be back with the follow-up: how do we get from here to there? Be sure of that!

G'night all!

Really? OK, then, if you must.

ISIHAC.

Or, for those unfamiliar with that acronym, I'm sorry, I haven't a clue.

Will that do for you?!

[teamsaint]

All together now: OF COURSE NOT!!!


All together now: OF COURSE NOT!!!

Have a good trip.

[teamsaint]

Do you prefer the soft centres or the hard centres?

either, but particularly the toffs !!
(had to work a bit on that !)

[An_Inspector_Calls]

The planned economy concept that has been raised on this thread could do away with investment in the market place by setting up its own fund. The planned economy would do away with all the vagaries, winners and losers, and all the concomitant degradations of spirit and motivation to do with purchasing product with inbuilt obsolescence and instability of value based on gambling schemes out of which todays turbocharged capitalism creates, perpetuates and widens the rich/poor divide. I believe such measures would garner massive popular support, including from those presently ineluctably implicated by virtue of financial schemes being beyond means of control, their own or, ultimately, anyone else's.



My point is that the market disproportionately benefits those whose manipulations of it disproportionately determine the outcomes of everyone else.

What a splendid idea, I'm surprised no one has tried it before.

Presumably this fund would be administered by a committee of the highest integrity and intellect, such as Brother Teamsaint, Brother Heliocentric and your good self, Brother Serial Apologist. That's a committee of perhaps two people. Brother Heliocentric can supply all the big words for those occasional moral-boosting pamphlets you'll need to publish. I'd have Brother Mark Serwotka along as political advisor or even Treasurer.

[french frank]

I hope we shall get back to a discussion of the political ideas - argument rather than sarcasm. I think of that as being more productive.

[eighthobstruction]

Yep ff, playing the (Comrade) Brother Mark Serwotka card was the last low blow....

[Serial_Apologist]

Presumably this fund would be administered by a committee of the highest integrity and intellect, such as Brother Teamsaint, Brother Heliocentric and your good self, Brother Serial Apologist.

Nah - I'd expect that Brothers would have been excommunicated by order of the Commisariat of Re-nemanclaturisation for Gender Equality by that stage...

argument rather than sarcasm

[An_Inspector_Calls]

I hope we shall get back to a discussion of the political ideas - argument rather than sarcasm. I think of that as being more productive.

Removal of sarcasm will not suffice; it seems all posts have to be left of centre if they're to be considered politely by others.

[heliocentric]

it seems all posts have to be left of centre if they're to be considered politely by others.

No, they just have to not contain gratuitous sniping at others. Where is this "centre" anyway?

[An_Inspector_Calls]

No, they just have to not contain gratuitous sniping at others. Where is this "centre" anyway?

A good question. Apparently questioning the role of the police in the resignation by a Tory whip is right wing - seems strange to me. Perhaps you can help us out?

[heliocentric]

A good question. Apparently questioning the role of the police in the resignation by a Tory whip is right wing - seems strange to me. Perhaps you can help us out?

Don't ask me, I never use the terms "right wing" and "left wing".

However, to be precise, you didn't "question the role of the police". You accused the officers in question, without any evidence whatsoever, of having "concocted a pack of lies which they released to the press because they wanted to attack the government over their pension cuts".

[teamsaint]

Just got in from a very long day on the road,( well mostly off it as the motor broke down) to discover that , if the hard working whitehall mandarin bank poodles want us all to work for out meagre OA pension(if we ever get there)...or in fact want to abolish retirement, which is what it boils down to.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-20044862

One day the people of this country will decide that enough is enough.

Incidentally, which bright spark at R3 decided to progamme what seems to be about a month of Wagner at going home time?

[Petrushka]

One day the people of this country will decide that enough is enough.

I wonder how bad things will have to get before that happens. My own final salary company pension will be closed in January but, naturally, the company directors and managers get to keep theirs. The whole thing has been greeted with a show of resigned apathy by most but with 7 years to go before retirement this sort of thing does no good at all to my already high BP.

[heliocentric]

or in fact want to abolish retirement, which is what it boils down to.

Every time you think the rain of insults is slowing down slightly, along comes another one from another direction. These people must really think they've got their hands nicely on the reins now; I know Bichard served under both Tory and Labour governments but there's something malodorous about his happening to raise this idea at a time when a Tory government is mounting a concerted attack on ordinary people and their expectations. What's that Sooty? It's a coalition government? Well, being a glove puppet yourself I imagine you would know all about the role of the Lib Dems.

[Eine Alpensinfonie]

...want us all to work for out meagre OA pension(if we ever get there)...or in fact want to abolish retirement, which is what it boils down to.

That does seem to be the basic plan - kill off the old people before they get old by making them work when their health is simply not up to it.

..Aided and abetted by Lord Hutton who did a U-turn over his previous pension reforms in order to gain another 30 pieces of silver - from his political opponents..