Time for a national, publicly-owned, railway?

[smittims]

Sorry to hear of your experience. I have so far much preferred Avanti to Virgin. I endured several bruising experiences with Virgin Trains, rudeness and arrogance from their staff, and irritation from the silly announcements, even in the toilet! I was glad to see the back of them.

But to return to the title of the thread, it was proved in 1914 that the railways are run much more efficiently as one system under central control. British Railways was ruined by short-term thinking , the Beeching report failing to foresee the continual rise in passneger numbers thereafter and the possibilities of organising a national freight network on European lines.

[DracoM]

<< the Beeching report failing to foresee the continual rise in passenger numbers thereafter and the possibilities of organising a national freight network on European lines. >>

AND both the Brexit and climate change impacts - which will surely multiply!

[Dave2002]

I went from the south coast to outer London rencently - Berwick to Surbiton. Took a lot of "research" to find a suitable ticket, and the restrictions on return for a cheap travelcard have become more severe in the last few years. Seems I wasn't permitted to travel between 4.15pm and 7.30pm on the return journey. According to the ticket office lady the last train I could use from Surbiton was at 4.02pm. There is/was an option to pay more to get an unrestricted ticket, but the differential was considerable so I decided to try to stay within the parameters. To be sure, I made sure my ticket was used to open the gate at Surbiton just before 4pm, which was the last time it was examined either by a machine or a human. After that it was chaos, as none of the trains were running - many had been cancelled or replaced by alternative trains, as there were problems round Gatwick, so I had to change not only at Clapham Junction, but also at Gatwich, then at Haywards Heath. At Gatwick I got on a southbound train, but almost immediately had to get off again, as the driver announced that he'd just been told not to stop at any of the stations after Three Bridges. Maybe this was an unusually unfortunate day - though I'm not sure. I had to stand from Clapham Junction to East Croydon, so the trains are certainly well packed - though does that justify the higher prices for trains at the peak periods? Maybe if the customers closer to London had a better service, then longer distance trains could miss out those commuter stations, and at least more people could then get a seat.

The trains themselves were really rather good, and reached a top speed of around 90mph.

It also took me a while beforehand to gradually absorb the implications of trains from Berwick going in opposition directions. Going west/north a change at Lewes is required, but going south/east a change at Polegate gets onto the same train. I suppose it allows some leeway in case people just miss the first train, or have other arcane preferences.

[french frank]

I went from the south coast to outer London rencently - Berwick to Surbiton.

I did a double-take on this. I had no idea that Berwick, East Sussex, had a functioning station. In fact, I'd never heard of Burwick (also known as Berrick). It seems to be rather small to have a station at all - but since it does …

[Old Grumpy]

I did a double-take on this. I had no idea that Berwick, East Sussex, had a functioning station. In fact, I'd never heard of Burwick (also known as Berrick). It seems to be rather small to have a station at all - but since it does …

My double take (possibly yours too) was Berwick, South coast?

Haway man, divvent ye nah its on the North East Coast [station or no station].

[french frank]

My double take (possibly yours too) was Berwick, South coast?

Haway man, divvent ye nah its on the North East Coast [station or no station].

Yes - though Berwick-on-Tweed to Surbiton would have been a fairly indirect journey.

[Old Grumpy]

Yes - though Berwick-on-Tweed to Surbiton would have been a fairly indirect journey.

Indeed!

[Dave2002]

Indeed!

Berwick is not quite on the coast, but it's within striking distance. Eastbourne isn't too far away.

[mikealdren]

I went from the south coast to outer London rencently - Berwick to Surbiton. Took a lot of "research" to find a suitable ticket, and the restrictions on return for a cheap travelcard have become more severe in the last few years. Seems I wasn't permitted to travel between 4.15pm and 7.30pm on the return journey. According to the ticket office lady the last train I could use from Surbiton was at 4.02pm. There is/was an option to pay more to get an unrestricted ticket, but the differential was considerable so I decided to try to stay within the parameters. To be sure, I made sure my ticket was used to open the gate at Surbiton just before 4pm, which was the last time it was examined either by a machine or a human. After that it was chaos, as none of the trains were running - many had been cancelled or replaced by alternative trains, as there were problems round Gatwick, so I had to change not only at Clapham Junction, but also at Gatwich, then at Haywards Heath. At Gatwick I got on a southbound train, but almost immediately had to get off again, as the driver announced that he'd just been told not to stop at any of the stations after Three Bridges. Maybe this was an unusually unfortunate day - though I'm not sure. I had to stand from Clapham Junction to East Croydon, so the trains are certainly well packed - though does that justify the higher prices for trains at the peak periods? Maybe if the customers closer to London had a better service, then longer distance trains could miss out those commuter stations, and at least more people could then get a seat.

The trains themselves were really rather good, and reached a top speed of around 90mph.

It also took me a while beforehand to gradually absorb the implications of trains from Berwick going in opposition directions. Going west/north a change at Lewes is required, but going south/east a change at Polegate gets onto the same train. I suppose it allows some leeway in case people just miss the first train, or have other arcane preferences.

Yes, this sounds like Southern Rail. Having said that, I'm not sure it was any better under British Rail and many of the problems are due to Network Rail which is nationalised.

[smittims]

Berwick is known to Bloomsbury fans; I think Duncan Grant or Vanessa Bell did some paintings in the church. That's how I knew it was in Sussex.

[Dave2002]

Berwick is known to Bloomsbury fans; I think Duncan Grant or Vanessa Bell did some paintings in the church. That's how I knew it was in Sussex.

Indeed. I guess I must have been into the church on a previous visit - see

Was this the only church which received this kind of artistic attention in the area?

Also see Charleston - and paintings by Duncan Grant - https://youtu.be/AhcdFwzdi-s

https://www.charleston.org.uk/

[Sir Velo]

Berwick is known to Bloomsbury fans; I think Duncan Grant or Vanessa Bell did some paintings in the church. That's how I knew it was in Sussex.

When I read Berwick, my immediate thought was to assume it must refer to one of the three Wiltshire Berwicks - St James; St Leonard or St John

[Serial_Apologist]

Yes, this sounds like Southern Rail. Having said that, I'm not sure it was any better under British Rail and many of the problems are due to Network Rail which is nationalised.

The person who minds the bed can't very well be blamed for the people who sleep in it!

[smittims]

Ah, Sir Velo, you remind me of the sailor who got off the train at Horwich, deep inland in Lancashire, and asked 'where's the docks?'.

[Sir Velo]

Ah, Sir Velo, you remind me of the sailor who got off the train at Horwich, deep inland in Lancashire, and asked 'where's the docks?'.

I was once asked by a Cockney cabbie if I knew where "Arijarba" was?